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  • kira
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2008
    • 2353

    The Election Upcoming

    Since we are getting close and things apparently are spinning quickly, thought this might be interesting and a good time to start a discussion. I thought it would be great to hear what everyone has to say about the upcoming election, those that are enduring here in this country and those that are watching from a far.
    Distraction is an obstruction of the construction.
  • theetruscan
    Senior Member
    • Jan 2008
    • 2270

    #2
    Originally posted by kira View Post
    Since we are getting close and things apparently are spinning quickly, thought this might be interesting and a good time to start a discussion. I thought it would be great to hear what everyone has to say about the upcoming election, those that are enduring here in this country and those that are watching from a far.
    I am baffled by McCain's choice of VP. She's under investigation for firing someone for not firing her sister's ex. She's under investigation for violations of federal law pertaining to advocating for a ballot measure (governors are banned from doing so). She's an advocate for massive drilling expansion married to an BP manager. She seems like she's a disaster for him, but I suppose once you start to go senile, there are other rules.

    Obama's speech yesterday struck me as one of the best I've seen or read. I wasn't particularly impressed by his VP choice, but it seemed less batshit insane to me.
    Hobo: We all dress up. We all put on our armour before we walk out the door, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re trying to be someone else.

    Comment

    • sam_tem
      Senior Member
      • Apr 2007
      • 650

      #3
      are there any politicians that don't deserve to be under investigation though? i would say her being married to a BP guy is just a geographical coincidence and not really a conflict of interest since i'm sure a majority of people in alaska are part of the oil business. i don't know anything about her, as most people don't, which is why it does seem like a smart move by the repbulicans to try and snag any disgruntled hillary supporters.

      i'm still trying to decide if i want to vote. i hate voting republican because of their stance on ethical issues (although i think mccain is sick of all those religious conservatives too) but i don't favor any of Obama's policies. i do want the capital gains tax rate to be left alone (i don't understand why our country would want to deter more people from saving/investing) and drilling to be expanded which mccain supports.

      in the end i know obama doesn't have the balls to reject anything a democratic house/senate will propose and i do believe it's dangerous when one party controls the gov't. if i vote, it seems like it will probably be for mccain for this reason alone.

      Comment

      • theetruscan
        Senior Member
        • Jan 2008
        • 2270

        #4
        (In direct response to Sam_Tem)

        There are plenty of politicians who don't deserve to be under investigation. There are plenty of politicians who do deserve to be under investigation. Palin's flagrant abuse of power and violation of federal law are not so much startling in themselves, but it is startling that the McCain campaign would approve/vet a VP candidate who is embroiled in scandal already. I mean, she had to suspend her chief of staff on Wednesday because of calls he made on her behalf that violated the law. Not only that, but the fact finding committee is due to publish its report on whether she should be indicted only a few days before the election. There is certainly something to the geographical coincidence in terms of her husband's employer, but there's also an apparent (real or not) conflict of interest in lobbying for something you are bound to directly benefit from financially.

        Vote or don't vote for your own reasons, but is leaving the presidential bubble blank sufficient reason to skip all the downticket issues? If you're in a state that uses touchscreen machines though, vote absentee (will include rundowns of the problems with the touchscreen machines if anyone cares, just got back from a voting machine conference, shit is terrifying).

        I fundamentally disagree with you about the capital gains issue, not because of the savings consideration, but because for many/most of the very high earners in this country, their income is classified as capital gains and taxed as such. This is bullshit. If those loopholes get fixed, and high earners pay income tax on their incomes, then I'm much less interested in the Capital Gains rates. Until then, the reduction in capital gains is utter nonsense, stealing from the country and giving to the rich.

        The drilling thing is worse though, and I'm going to be nasty here. Support for increased offshore drilling is fucking stupid. There is a 5-10 year window before we see any potential increase in oil output. The potential increase is negligible (<1&#37; of the US oil usage at peak). The environmental disaster of offshore rigs in storm areas is terrifying (look at satelite pictures during/after Katrina). Double the potential increase at peak is shipped out of the US by US oil companies daily, if we're that worried, why do we freely ship out the oil drilled now? Huge tracts of already permitted leases for offshore drilling in some of the most fertile areas are currently unutilized by oil companies. What is the motivation to increase what we give them if they currently ship oil out of the country and don't use what we've already given them? I am happy to cite sources if you're curious about any of this.

        One party control is another issue, and you're on your own there, I think the Democratic party is too much of a bunch of pathetic pussies to override 41 republican senators on any issue ever so I don't see how it matters. We only get one party control when the Republicans have it because their caucus is disciplined enough to forcibly override democratic fillibusters. The democratic party lacks that discipline, and by extension lacks the ability to exercise true one party control.

        I am, however, hardly neutral. McCain's warlike preferences, combined with his violently unstable temper terrifies me, because he will start more wars, and the idea of pointlessly killing that many more poor suckers being stop-lossed back into the military makes me physically ill.
        Hobo: We all dress up. We all put on our armour before we walk out the door, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re trying to be someone else.

        Comment

        • AKA*NYC
          Senior Member
          • Nov 2007
          • 3007

          #5
          Originally posted by theetruscan View Post
          McCain's warlike preferences, combined with his violently unstable temper terrifies me, because he will start more wars
          I wholeheartedly agree and this is reason enough to vote for Obama.
          LOVE THE SHIRST... HOW much?

          Comment

          • Faust
            kitsch killer
            • Sep 2006
            • 37852

            #6
            Originally posted by theetruscan View Post
            I am baffled by McCain's choice of VP. She's under investigation for firing someone for not firing her sister's ex. She's under investigation for violations of federal law pertaining to advocating for a ballot measure (governors are banned from doing so). She's an advocate for massive drilling expansion married to an BP manager. She seems like she's a disaster for him, but I suppose once you start to go senile, there are other rules.

            Obama's speech yesterday struck me as one of the best I've seen or read. I wasn't particularly impressed by his VP choice, but it seemed less batshit insane to me.
            Why baffled? Seems like a perfecate candidate to continue the republican legacy. 8 years are not enough to wreck such a powerful country - we need at least 8 more.
            Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

            StyleZeitgeist Magazine

            Comment

            • theetruscan
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2008
              • 2270

              #7
              Originally posted by Faust View Post
              Why baffled? Seems like a perfecate candidate to continue the republican legacy. 8 years are not enough to wreck such a powerful country - we need at least 8 more.
              I agree with you about what they're doing, for sure. The thing is, the Republicans certainly want to win, no matter how I feel about them. From the political perspective it seems baffling. She's a good fit on the ideology front.
              Hobo: We all dress up. We all put on our armour before we walk out the door, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re trying to be someone else.

              Comment

              • Faust
                kitsch killer
                • Sep 2006
                • 37852

                #8
                I am not voting in this election either. Because 70% of New York State vote democrat

                BTW, I am not so sure McCain is such a hawk. I believe he is a great student of Eisenhower, who warned the public that the USA becoming an economic-military complex. Watch a documentary called Why We Fight - he talks a bit about his position there.

                Anyway, it doesn't matter to me. My position is that you don't just pick a President, you pick a party. I am much more concerned with the state of the Supreme Court - having more Democrat justices on the bench to me is more important than any f-ing political decision that comes out of the executive branch. So, yea, it's all Dems for me.
                Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                Comment

                • theetruscan
                  Senior Member
                  • Jan 2008
                  • 2270

                  #9
                  Best article about Palin ever (note, I haven't factchecked it):


                  On the more serious side, if she's having to scrub the website day of the announcement . . .

                  ZEUSQQ adalah Situs slot gacor hari ini slot88 mudah menang slot777 gampang maxwin agen bandar terbaik terpercaya resmi, Daftar link login gratis game terbaru


                  and so on:
                  Walt Monegan, former public safety commissioner, says that he was pressured to fire trooper Mike Wooten, the former brother-in-law of Alaska Governor Sarah Palin, who was named today as John McCain's vice-presidential pick. State senator Hollis French was given authority to hire indedendent investigator Stephen Branchfeather to conduct a probe into the matter, which has already brought resulted in Palin aide Frank Bailey being placed on administrative leave.


                  and on:


                  Seems like a characteristically stupid, impetuous choice from mccain.
                  Last edited by theetruscan; 08-30-2008, 01:51 PM.
                  Hobo: We all dress up. We all put on our armour before we walk out the door, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that we’re trying to be someone else.

                  Comment

                  • justine
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2007
                    • 672

                    #10
                    2, 3 weeks ago, the channel 13 program "NOW" (or was it Bill Moyers?) had a good doc on the "good ol' boy" corruption network in Alaska; and it's clear Paulin did a great job at cleaning up that mess.
                    Having said that, imagining her President if McCain dies is just mind boggling.

                    Comment

                    • justine
                      Senior Member
                      • Jan 2007
                      • 672

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Faust View Post
                      BTW, I am not so sure McCain is such a hawk.
                      That's the biggest question for me...his rhetoric certainly is ("He'll make Cheney look like Ghandi" was a great Buchanan quote).

                      Comment

                      • philip nod
                        Senior Member
                        • Aug 2007
                        • 5903

                        #12
                        LATER

                        this shit is so fucked its now a full fledged comedy

                        http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us/politics/02PALINDAY.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin
                        One wonders where it will end, when everything has become gay.

                        Comment

                        • ddohnggo
                          Senior Member
                          • Oct 2006
                          • 4477

                          #13
                          Did you get and like the larger dick?

                          Comment

                          • electric_alyce
                            Senior Member
                            • Mar 2008
                            • 314

                            #14
                            Watching from afar here, and may be a bit biased due to the fact that european media seems to favor Obama (hey, if America is a bit more stable, we don't have to be so jumpy). On the other hand, europe is a bit (hah) egosentric, and will be quick to condemn the war in iraq, but if Russia suddenly attacks Norway and threatens the whole of Europe - and America don't want to intervene they will probably be bitchy about that too. It's just a bit too fascinating, how the two candidates are such polar opposites. I think my (...fictional) vote goes for Obama, America needs to see they can change, even though it's small steps at first.
                            Smile! It's the apocalypse

                            Comment

                            • Faust
                              kitsch killer
                              • Sep 2006
                              • 37852

                              #15
                              Originally posted by philip nod View Post
                              More material for the Daily Show. Of course, abortion is out of the question for a Republican. Nice. 1757 comments on NYT, lol.
                              Last edited by Faust; 09-02-2008, 08:55 AM.
                              Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                              StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                              Comment

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