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  • zamb
    Senior Member
    • Nov 2006
    • 5834

    NBA Playoffs.

    Ok, the playoffs began today..............
    seems like if all goes as its going, we will have the clash of the overated , overpaid superstars in Lebron and Kobe in the finals
    Sucks
    My Spurs in the west are injured again, so there goes the Lakers easy route to the finals. and the Celtics are missing Garnett, its no wonder that both teams lost to the Bulls and Mavericks respectively............

    While Dwayne Wade is the real league MVP, the Lebron butt kissers will give it to him..................
    this is the kind of Hypocrisy that I hate about the NBA, I like the sport, so i still watch.

    Lets hear your views
    “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
    .................................................. .......................


    Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock
  • Jon
    Senior Member
    • Apr 2008
    • 677

    #2
    haha, haven't been watching basketball much for years but caught most of the celtics/bulls game and the cavs/pistons game. detroit pretty much capitulated from the start and refused to play defense. way too easy for the cavs. the bulls played great but I'd be surprised (pleasantly so) if the celtics didn't come out on top in that series.

    you're so right, Zamb so many egos in the league right now make it a pretty sad media circus. i was disgusted by the bias shown during the cavs game...
    Originally posted by merz
    perhaps one day pipcleo will post a wywt so non-euclydian & eldrich in its shapes as to turn all onlookers into throngs of dishevelled, muttering idiots

    Comment

    • mass
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2006
      • 1131

      #3
      i hate lebron with a passion

      agreed about wade being mvp

      boston and portland are my teams

      and then i'm also rooting for chicago to a lesser extent... even if i hated them during the 90s; rose is one of my favorites in the league right now, but i feel the celtics have a better chance at beating cleveland

      Comment

      • Real Real
        Senior Member
        • Feb 2007
        • 619

        #4
        Wade as MVP? LeBron is having one of the greatest seasons anyone has ever had (leading his team in all four statistical categories)?. He's a much better defender than Wade. Wade's supporting cast is significantly more talented than LeBron's - yet the Cavaliers have had an all-time great season.

        Which team would have probably had more wins this season, had LeBron been traded for Wade straight up before the season?

        I do agree that the refs have been particularly bad recently.
        Last edited by Real Real; 04-19-2009, 01:27 AM.

        Comment

        • kofi3159
          Senior Member
          • Feb 2009
          • 204

          #5
          Dont hate lebron.. Wade as mvp over Lebron doesnt seem plausible to me..
          Do people honestly think spurs has a chance against lakers, even with all their stars??

          Comment

          • zamb
            Senior Member
            • Nov 2006
            • 5834

            #6
            Originally posted by Real Real View Post
            Wade as MVP? LeBron is having one of the greatest seasons anyone has ever had (leading his team in all four statistical categories)?. He's a much better defender than Wade. Wade's supporting cast is significantly more talented than LeBron's - yet the Cavaliers have had an all-time great season.

            Which team would have probably had more wins this season, had LeBron been traded for Wade straight up before the season?

            I do agree that the refs have been particularly bad recently.
            seems you have bought the hype pill and taken an overdose......
            how can you say that wades supporting cast is better when wade has to play with
            Mario Calmers,
            Chris Quinn
            Micheal Beasly
            An injured and washed up Germaine Oneal
            etc.

            Lebron has
            Mo williams
            Ben Wallace
            Zydrunas Ilgauskas
            Delonte and a series of other veterans on his team
            the Cav went to the conference finals last year while the heat won only fifteen games with wade coming off TWO off season surgery.

            Now lets talk abouty stats
            • Wade- 29.9 (leads NBA)
            • James- 28.5 (2nd in NBA)
            Assists per game
            • Wade- 7.6 (8th in NBA)
            • James- 7.2 (10th in NBA)
            Rebounds per game
            • James- 7.6
            • Wade- 5.2
            Steals per game
            • Wade- 2.25 (2nd in NBA)
            • James- 1.8
            Blocks per game
            • Wade- 1.4
            • James- 1.28

            Wade shoots a better field goal percentage than james
            49.2 vs 48.7%

            also bear in mind that wade is 6"4" to james 6"8" so hos block stats is really impressive, matter of fact i think its record setting. Wade Has the Better Stats and his team has made the biggest Jump with him having to overcome the most. he is by any FAIR measure the unquestioned MVP!
            “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
            .................................................. .......................


            Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock

            Comment

            • dan.de
              Member
              • Jan 2009
              • 38

              #7
              i would say their stats are equivalent. if you combine those you have mentioned with playing time and turnovers i dont think that you can say that one is better than the other (especially because they play different positions).
              the cavs improved from 45 wins to 66 this season. for sure the jump of the heat is greater but its harder to improve a 45win season than a 19win (or whatever).
              no doubt that lebrons sup cast is better but its not that unfair when lebron gets the trophy

              Comment

              • ddohnggo
                Senior Member
                • Oct 2006
                • 4477

                #8
                glad this thread was made because i was going to make it. i don't understand everyone's hate on lebron james. he is the true mvp this year. i love d-wade, don't get me wrong, but the sheer fact that lebron took his team to the top record in the NBA (beating the lakers mind you without having top players such as gasol and odom in his line up), having the best home record, being the most efficient player, leading the league in triple doubles, and averaging 28 points, 7 boards, 7 assists consistently is something special.

                the whole argument that d-wade plays with subpar players is true. HOWEVER, lebron took his cavs team the last year to the conference finals (took the celtics to 7 games) and the year before that took the cavs to the finals. he also had a pretty shitty team. he did NOT have mo williams and delonte west on those teams, but sasha pavlovic was a fucking starter. dwade won a championship with shaq, alonzo mourning (aging), james posey, and gary payton (aging). puh-lease. granted, the cavs were swept, but they didn't have the fire power, albeit aging fire power, that dwade had on that team.

                in terms of stats, dwade had a spectacular season. the reason why his stats were higher because he was the ONLY good player on that team. lebron's supporting cast is stronger (mo williams an all star) and demand chances to touch the ball more than the heat team, yet lebron still averaged that many points, assists and rebounds, most likely giving him less chances to do all the things that dwade did.

                also, derrick rose having a game like he did against boston yesterday was so ridiculous. kid is on fire. and portland got their asses handed to them by the rockets. yao went 9-9 from the field.
                Did you get and like the larger dick?

                Comment

                • zamb
                  Senior Member
                  • Nov 2006
                  • 5834

                  #9
                  Let me make it clear, I don't hate Lebron James, I honestly think he is a an excellent player, I am not using the word "great" as I believe that such terms are best bestowed on persons that have established a body of work, over time that can be measured against others who are luminaries in the field, so in that sense, he will be a great player........ all things being well.
                  what I hate is the ass kissing, the over hype, and the bias given in his favor (the same reasons I ended up detesting the Jordan era) by a majority of the commentators and organizers of the league.
                  the MVP is defined as the player Most valuable to his teams accomplishment. the easy way to solve the problem is to ask what would be the level of success a team could have, minus its best player. the team the Cavs have minus James, would be better than the Miami heat would be minus Wade.
                  Now the hypocrites want to skew the definition to be which player is most valuable to the league itself. that to me is the fundamental problem I have.
                  Last edited by zamb; 04-19-2009, 01:49 PM.
                  “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
                  .................................................. .......................


                  Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock

                  Comment

                  • hamham3002
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 145

                    #10
                    love the young portland team.. but ROY aint enough to put out a playoff victory against artest, battier, yao and finger wagger, not to mention aaron brooks lighting it up.. its not about the experience, its about the rest of the portland team stepping up.. defensively and offensively..

                    lebron should be MVP although i have no love for him.... he has made everyone better, he makes the game so easy for the rest of the team.. and he has more wins than any team..
                    wade is great, but too bad he hasn't won as much as lebron..

                    and about zamb's point abt overrated n overpaid superstars... sooo true.. everyone's asking for max money now a days, talking abt going to other teams for 3 more mil... fuck.. wheres the loyalty to the team that drafted you, trained you and shit.. back in the days, you don't see this happen as much

                    lakers vs. jazz... KOBE timeeeeee baby..

                    Comment

                    • zamb
                      Senior Member
                      • Nov 2006
                      • 5834

                      #11
                      Originally posted by ddohnggo View Post
                      glad this thread was made because i was going to make it. i don't understand everyone's hate on lebron james. he is the true mvp this year. i love d-wade, don't get me wrong, but the sheer fact that lebron took his team to the top record in the NBA (beating the lakers mind you without having top players such as gasol and odom in his line up), having the best home record, being the most efficient player, leading the league in triple doubles, and averaging 28 points, 7 boards, 7 assists consistently is something special.

                      the whole argument that d-wade plays with subpar players is true. HOWEVER, lebron took his cavs team the last year to the conference finals (took the celtics to 7 games) and the year before that took the cavs to the finals. he also had a pretty shitty team. he did NOT have mo williams and delonte west on those teams, but sasha pavlovic was a fucking starter. dwade won a championship with shaq, alonzo mourning (aging), james posey, and gary payton (aging). puh-lease. granted, the cavs were swept, but they didn't have the fire power, albeit aging fire power, that dwade had on that team.

                      in terms of stats, dwade had a spectacular season. the reason why his stats were higher because he was the ONLY good player on that team. lebron's supporting cast is stronger (mo williams an all star) and demand chances to touch the ball more than the heat team, yet lebron still averaged that many points, assists and rebounds, most likely giving him less chances to do all the things that dwade did.

                      also, derrick rose having a game like he did against boston yesterday was so ridiculous. kid is on fire. and portland got their asses handed to them by the rockets. yao went 9-9 from the field.
                      Joey,
                      Hence my belief that he should be the MVP. because he is the only good player on a team that made a huge leap from one season to the next. also the team had a major trade in Midseason (Jermaine O'neal for Shawn Marion) and was still able to readjust,

                      I was at Church yesterday so I didnt see the Celtics/ Bulls game, it seems good stats wise though, and now they have home court advantage.
                      it would be HUGE if they knock off boston........ even without KG

                      Hamham 3002,

                      Wade has wom more than James, Wade has a championship and James hasn't won one yet.
                      alaso it doesnt matter what they have done in the past (except for last year, in order to make comparisons for the sake of progress) the issue is about this years accomplishments to determine who is the MVP.
                      “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
                      .................................................. .......................


                      Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock

                      Comment

                      • ddohnggo
                        Senior Member
                        • Oct 2006
                        • 4477

                        #12
                        you can't discount the fact that lebron led his team to the BEST record in the NBA. no matter how much talent you have on a team, you can't make them win. if lebron james was not on the cavs, they would be pretty shitty. who would lead that team? mo williams? ben wallace? ya right. so making a leap from a good team to the BEST team in the nba isn't impressive? that's more impressive than getting into the 7th seed of the playoffs, barely over 500. if they were in the western conference they would be 18th place not even in the playoffs.

                        additionally, wade winning a championship is based on circumstance. had lebron james had those veterans on his team, he could likely win a championship as well.

                        regarding kobe, i hate that guy, but he's amazing.
                        Did you get and like the larger dick?

                        Comment

                        • Casius
                          Senior Member
                          • Dec 2006
                          • 4772

                          #13
                          Everyone wants to hate the all star. I remember reading and hearing the same things during the Jordan era.
                          Honestly, Lebron could have won MVP for the last 3 years and I would have had no problem with it. The kid came in to the league right out of high school and has become the player he is now; No other NBA player has done that and done it as fast and as efficient as Lebron. He's a beast, straight up. Not to mention he's a team guy, all around (I can't say the same for Jordan back in the day). The hype around Lebron isn't because Lebron is asking for it; It comes when you're just that good and he can't help how good he is.
                          I do love D. Wade as well and have for quite some time. He's an explosive player that is always fun to watch but I don't think he's as much of a well rounded (especially given the age/league difference) as Lebron. D. Wade's supporting cast isn't as good this season as it's been in the past but it's been like that for quite some time now (I was surprised when they won with Shaq on the damn squad).
                          For me, I could really care less about the Lakers, I've always been put off by Kobe's attitude and could never really become a fan. I'm having a good time watching Nowitzki and Josh Howard.
                          "because the young are whores. dealers come to carol to get the rock"

                          Comment

                          • hamham3002
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 145

                            #14
                            ya zamb.. definitely.. like you said, since past seasons shouldnt matter, wade winning a championship, or the difference between this year and last year's record shouldnt be factored in the MVP talk..
                            this year, the caves has won the most games, and i think plays a big factor..
                            i agree, the heat has a weaker team aside from wade.. but for lebron's team, mo williams was a good player, but hes an allstar because of lebron and others has played better because of him..
                            i havent seen too many heats game, but from the one's i have seen, wade doesn't have as big of an affect on his team as lebron..

                            Comment

                            • zamb
                              Senior Member
                              • Nov 2006
                              • 5834

                              #15
                              Originally posted by ddohnggo View Post
                              you can't discount the fact that lebron led his team to the BEST record in the NBA. no matter how much talent you have on a team, you can't make them win. if lebron james was not on the cavs, they would be pretty shitty. who would lead that team? mo williams? ben wallace? ya right. so making a leap from a good team to the BEST team in the nba isn't impressive? that's more impressive than getting into the 7th seed of the playoffs, barely over 500. if they were in the western conference they would be 18th place not even in the playoffs.

                              additionally, wade winning a championship is based on circumstance. had lebron james had those veterans on his team, he could likely win a championship as well.

                              regarding kobe, i hate that guy, but he's amazing.
                              If wade was not on the Heat, who would lead them?
                              what we are taking about is two players who are of similar circumstances, except james team has had the experience, from going to the finals two years ago, and the conference finals last year, so they are expected to be one of the top teams in the league, they have the same coach and many of the players that went to the finals.
                              with wade, not so they won fiteen games, was not a playoff team has rookies playing major minutes and the star coming off two off season surgery.
                              but I see this being an endless debate so im going to rest my case

                              there is no certainty that having the verterans would have won lebron a championship. in the not so distant past, the lakers were beaten by the spurs, ending thier triple championship run. they retooled adding the Great Karl Malone and the same Gary Payton that ended up winning with the Heat. we can remember that 4-1 butt kicking that was handed out by the Pistons.

                              Originally posted by Casius View Post
                              Everyone wants to hate the all star. I remember reading and hearing the same things during the Jordan era.
                              Honestly, Lebron could have won MVP for the last 3 years and I would have had no problem with it. The kid came in to the league right out of high school and has become the player he is now; No other NBA player has done that and done it as fast and as efficient as Lebron. He's a beast, straight up. Not to mention he's a team guy, all around (I can't say the same for Jordan back in the day). The hype around Lebron isn't because Lebron is asking for it; It comes when you're just that good and he can't help how good he is.
                              I do love D. Wade as well and have for quite some time. He's an explosive player that is always fun to watch but I don't think he's as much of a well rounded (especially given the age/league difference) as Lebron. D. Wade's supporting cast isn't as good this season as it's been in the past but it's been like that for quite some time now (I was surprised when they won with Shaq on the damn squad).
                              For me, I could really care less about the Lakers, I've always been put off by Kobe's attitude and could never really become a fan. I'm having a good time watching Nowitzki and Josh Howard.
                              for a moment I want to remind you of a player called Tim Duncan, that except for the straight outa high school portion, was (and still is) even more impressive than that.
                              then you have to read about the great

                              Lew Alcindor (the Lakers call him Kareem)
                              Oscar Robertson (Mr Triple Double) and in my opinion the best player ever to touch a baketball
                              Moses malone
                              Bill Russell............. all of which had far more impressive five year careers than lebron is now having
                              “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
                              .................................................. .......................


                              Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock

                              Comment

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