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Louise Martin: Listen Up (small interview)

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  • laika
    moderator
    • Sep 2006
    • 3785

    Louise Martin: Listen Up (small interview)

    Really interesting and articulate take on the state of fashion from Cathy Horyn's blog. For those who don't know, Louise Wilson is director of the M.A. program at CSM.

    ON THE RUNWAY
    July 6, 2009

    During the gap between Paris men’s and couture, I was in London, where I spent an instructive hour with Louise Wilson, the course director of the M.A. program at Central Saint Martins. Without Saint Martins, I doubt fashion studios in Europe and New York would be able to function. The school is a prime source for assistants, and it is Professor Wilson whom designers like Mr. Elbaz call for recommendations. The MA program at Saint Martins has also produced top designers, among them Alexander McQueen, Christopher Kane and Marios Schwab. Very little seems to escape Professor Wilson’s eye and lashing opinion. She is tough and funny, with a flurry of unprintable words and self-deprecating jabs (“a bitter and twisted cow” she once called herself). Suffice it to say, the professor has high standards.

    What she sees from her office in Charing Cross Road:
    You know, the fashion industry hasn’t changed. Companies want ideas. And they want more than one idea when they interview students for jobs. They want multiple ideas. My mantra now is the only thing these students have to offer is youth, and if they can’t offer that, then we’re all in trouble. I can still draw and do flats. I know how to do research, as does anyone my age who might happen to be a design director. When you employ someone you want youth. You want their fresh take on things. So I’ve been thinking a lot about what is youth.
    Did the industry plan that everyone would travel to the same countries, that everyone would have disposable means of income, that everybody would be quite bland? I recently interviewed someone coming to the MA program and they said the last film they had seen was “Valkyrie,” with Tom Cruise. I said, “You’re joking, aren’t you?” I said, “Did you go to the cinema?” And they said yes. And I said, “Well, I could understand watching it on an airline flight. But it’s not the thing you would say. You would lie.”
    There are immensely talented people around but I feel huge vortexes of them are sucked into this mediocre world where nobody criticizes and it’s all terribly politically correct. Even journalists are the same. You now hardly get a bad a review. In their mind the journalists are supporting the industry, so they don’t want to dish it. For me it’s that banality of what is youth. Even the way they put themselves together. Again, today, I was interviewing people for the MA program, and I said, “Why are you dressed like Topman?” Maybe it is a Miu Miu shirt, but essentially it’s Topman. It’s got no individuality at all. You’ve not stretched the neck of the T-shirt. You’ve not denoted your uniform. You’re not even wearing non-fashion. You’re not even saying that. You’re saying nothing.
    When did she first notice this change?
    About four years ago. You used to see people all the time in the corridors and you’d think, That’s a great look. That’s clever the way you put that together.
    So what’s the explanation?
    Most of them have no opinion. They do the work so well, and so diligently, and who cares? There are loads of people already doing it. I have come to the viewpoint that nothing is happening. That’s why straight men now look gayer than gay men. I ask the students why that is, and they look at me like I’m mad. It’s that blurring of the lines, the stripping down. They take no risks about anything, not even the way they go up against the industry or show their clothes. It’s all about being professional.
    I always say to students, “You’re never going to have all the skills but you have to have a skill.” I was talking to a girl today and she said, “Well, I’ve worked really hard.” And I said, “It’s not about working hard. It’s about feeling sick and waiting for the idea and not knowing what to do but making sure you have the skills so that when you do get the idea, you can do it without relying on other people.” That’s another thing I’ve noticed today—everything is farmed out. Someone else is going to cut it, and someone else is going to supply the fabrics. The hands-on gets more and more removed. If Lee McQueen or Christopher Kane had nothing, they could still make their garments. They have the skills.
    I think the problem is that fashion has become too fashionable. For years, fashion wasn’t fashionable. Today fashion is so fashionable that it’s almost embarrassing to say you’re part of fashion. All the parodies of it. All the dreadful magazines. That has destroyed it as well, because everybody thinks fashion is attainable.
    Today fashion is dominated by big luxury brands. Talented designers are stars but they also lose touch.
    I think what happens is designers get older and they travel more comfortably. They go on holidays to places where they wouldn’t have gone before. It all gets removed. And then they think they’re dressing those people. It can’t be sniffed about. Once you have met all those clients, it’s hard to erase them. Once you know that your customer is 67 and about to pop it, it’s always at the back of your mind. But when you are starting out, and you’re Ann Demeulemeester or any of them, you’re dressing your friends, and your friends reflect something. And this goes back to nowadays. When you speak to designers, they’re not dressing their friends, because they’re friends don’t wear the clothes. That’s pretty scary to me.
    What will be the impact on design innovation?
    If I knew the answer to that I wouldn’t be sitting here and I’d be very rich. It might be very good for fashion if fashion goes out of fashion, and maybe nothing does happen for awhile and a few companies shut down. When the light turns away that’s when the new work will be done.

    http://runway.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/06/louise-wilson-listen-up/
    ...I mean the ephemeral, the fugitive, the contingent, the half of art whose other half is the eternal and the immutable.
  • Faust
    kitsch killer
    • Sep 2006
    • 37849

    #2
    Thanks, laika. Sounds like CSM students = Parsons students.
    Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

    StyleZeitgeist Magazine

    Comment

    • swami
      Senior Member
      • Jul 2008
      • 809

      #3
      Great article, thanks!
      RE YOUTH: Its also probably just the sign of the times , There is nothing the youth need to stand up for anymore its only all about getting succesful in the rat race s and to be one step ahead of your peers.

      OH! and where to kop????

      Comment

      • Johnny
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2006
        • 1923

        #4
        yes thanks, interesting read. she does perhaps come across as a grumpy old woman though - you know, "everything's shit these days; young people today; etc". which is fair enough I suppose.

        Comment

        • Faust
          kitsch killer
          • Sep 2006
          • 37849

          #5
          because it's true. young people suck! ;-)
          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

          Comment

          • Sombre
            Senior Member
            • Jan 2009
            • 1291

            #6
            ^Oddly enough, young people are saying exactly the same thing about old people. I guess we'll never reconcile the generational gap.

            I once made a fool of myself in a high school history class, and then proceeded to ask the teacher if it worried him that my generation will someday make the laws that govern him. I expected him to utter a cliche about the putrid state of today's youth. Surprisingly, he said, "No, that's what every generation says, and we always end up fine." I think the same can be said about fashion. There will be stagnant times; it is a reflection of society after all. But that's not to say there is no creativity and there is no one pushing boundaries. Haven't we seen very talented designers pop up in the past three years and do very well?

            Also, just because someone isn't screaming anarchy or rebellion at the top of his/her lungs doesn't mean he/she has become bland or "has no opinion." I realize some people long for the days of Galliano and McQueen mischief, or Lagerfeld sending invalids and whores down the runway, but something like that should not be forced or begged for. That's when pantomimes and grandstanders emerge from all crevices.
            An artist is not paid for his labor, but for his vision. - James Whistler

            Originally posted by BBSCCP
            I order 1 in every size, please, for every occasion

            Comment

            • Faust
              kitsch killer
              • Sep 2006
              • 37849

              #7
              I was teasing of course :-). I know exactly what you are saying. However, I would like to know who you have in mind as talented new designers who have done well.
              Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

              StyleZeitgeist Magazine

              Comment

              • Sombre
                Senior Member
                • Jan 2009
                • 1291

                #8
                BBS, DD, Odyn Vovk, although tbh it's really their lines that are new, since they've been designing for years.

                I guess the best example of brand new successful designers I can think of would be the Mulleavy sisters at Rodarte.
                An artist is not paid for his labor, but for his vision. - James Whistler

                Originally posted by BBSCCP
                I order 1 in every size, please, for every occasion

                Comment

                • Faust
                  kitsch killer
                  • Sep 2006
                  • 37849

                  #9
                  You surely jest? It's too early to put any of these designers into this category. They have neither proved to be great, nor do we know if they will be around in the next 5 years. I would understand if you said Rick Owens.
                  Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                  StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                  Comment

                  • Sombre
                    Senior Member
                    • Jan 2009
                    • 1291

                    #10
                    Rick Owens has been around for too long (12 years including LA?) to be put into that category.

                    What you said is true, but I meant successful in the sense that their clothes are selling well and being bought by respected boutiques, and they're critically well-received, so successful in an "au courant" sense.

                    As for longevity, that does remain to be seen. I have doubts about some, but I haven't expressed them because I have no real analytical basis for them. It will be interesting to see how the labels and designers grow and mature.
                    An artist is not paid for his labor, but for his vision. - James Whistler

                    Originally posted by BBSCCP
                    I order 1 in every size, please, for every occasion

                    Comment

                    • Faust
                      kitsch killer
                      • Sep 2006
                      • 37849

                      #11
                      I think in fashion terms and timing Rick fits the bill perfectly. Remember, his first show was only in 2002. I am talking about designers who have made impact on fashion and stayed independent - Ann, RAF, yohji, rei, dries, etc. Just because a new kid with financial backers hires totem, that does not guarantee that he will sell at atelier two years from now. Everyone these days wants the next hot thing now, which often leads to overexpansion and subsequent folding of the brand.
                      Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                      StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                      Comment

                      • Sombre
                        Senior Member
                        • Jan 2009
                        • 1291

                        #12
                        I thought we were talking about the last 5 years only.

                        If you expand the scope, off the top of my head my choices would be: Raf Simons, Ann Demeulemeester, Yohji Yamamoto, Rick Owens, Hedi Slimane, Hussein Chalayan, Helmut Lang, Alexandre Plokhov, among others that aren't coming to me.

                        About overexpansion, that was what I thought was happening with Rick, but he seems to have a clear focus of what he wants out of his label, as well as an awareness of it, so maybe (hopefully) I'm wrong.

                        I don't think BBS has that problem, as it's still pretty difficult to find, and it isn't something you would randomly come across. I think DD could have that problem in the not so distant future though.
                        An artist is not paid for his labor, but for his vision. - James Whistler

                        Originally posted by BBSCCP
                        I order 1 in every size, please, for every occasion

                        Comment

                        • Faust
                          kitsch killer
                          • Sep 2006
                          • 37849

                          #13
                          I guess I should clarify - maybe breaking designers up by decades is a good indicator. So let's start with someone achieving prominence in 2000 and after. I'd say besides Rick Owens and Jun Takahashi we don't have much to go on. Cloak is gone. Number Nine too. Veronique Branquinho as well. You could say that there are some good designers working for large houses, like Elbaz, but that's already a different story.
                          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                          Comment

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