Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

random fashion thoughts

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • julian_doe
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2013
    • 339

    Originally posted by Avalon View Post

    You can't put a price on concept and rarity obviously, but sacrificing quality for these values is seldom necessary. Save that for runway pieces...
    I agree with Zam.

    Also, "quality" is perceptual and not always synonymous with durability.

    I am not rich either and definitely protect (often to fastidious extents) my most rare, artisanal, and coveted pieces. These CCP pieces are given the highest value by me (because value is also perceptual), and I don't wear them because I want them to thrive for years without the unavoidable wear which daily use would inflict on the Visible Meltlock seams or the beautiful fabrics.

    What I think is a problem, is the exorbitant price given to "hype" pieces. It may be bias, but I have a super hard time differentiating the "quality" between a Supreme pullover and a Fruit of the Loom one. I am entirely unable to find a heightened quality neither in design nor in construction that matches the higher price.

    Comment

    • Nickefuge
      Senior Member
      • Nov 2014
      • 860

      Originally posted by julian_doe View Post
      I am entirely unable to find a heightened quality neither in design nor in construction that matches the higher price.
      This is the perceived value you described yourself. although it’s rather the effect of people confusing rarity and hype with actual value/quality.
      "The only rule is don't be boring and dress cute wherever you go. Life is too short to blend in."
      -Paris Hilton

      Comment

      • TriggerDiscipline
        Senior Member
        • Apr 2013
        • 859

        Originally posted by zamb View Post
        a brand can be both...………..
        In my experience I think that refers to brands like Hermes, in where its luxurious because there are no imperfections due to the artisan's skill.
        Originally posted by unwashed
        Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
        Originally posted by Ahimsa
        I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

        Comment

        • Faust
          kitsch killer
          • Sep 2006
          • 37852

          Originally posted by Monoral View Post
          What is a luxury brand nowadays? Is it material used or the brand name/legacy?
          Or is it mainly social media hype?
          The one that has bigger logos on sweatshirts and an advertising/PR budget to buy everyone.
          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

          Comment

          • zamb
            Senior Member
            • Nov 2006
            • 5834

            Originally posted by TriggerDiscipline View Post
            In my experience I think that refers to brands like Hermes, in where its luxurious because there are no imperfections due to the artisan's skill.
            Yes but another way of looking at it is that a brand like Hermes "wastes" a lot of materials because anything that doesn't meet the standard of "imperfection" must be rejected as suitable for Production.
            compare that with a brand like CCP, that emphasizes the imperfection and turns it into artistic beauty...………..

            Sometimes I go to the Tannery to buy leather, and I don't want the leather they have coated or spray to look perfect. I want the ones with discolorations, bit marks, scars etc that gives a history of the process and the animal from which it came.

            there is a "luxury" customer who does not want perfect things, but want things with Character and imperfect expression
            “You know,” he says, with a resilient smile, “it is a hard world for poets.”
            .................................................. .......................


            Zam Barrett Spring 2017 Now in stock

            Comment

            • TriggerDiscipline
              Senior Member
              • Apr 2013
              • 859

              Originally posted by zamb View Post
              Yes but another way of looking at it is that a brand like Hermes "wastes" a lot of materials because anything that doesn't meet the standard of "imperfection" must be rejected as suitable for Production.
              compare that with a brand like CCP, that emphasizes the imperfection and turns it into artistic beauty...………..

              Sometimes I go to the Tannery to buy leather, and I don't want the leather they have coated or spray to look perfect. I want the ones with discolorations, bit marks, scars etc that gives a history of the process and the animal from which it came.

              there is a "luxury" customer who does not want perfect things, but want things with Character and imperfect expression
              sure, but by traditional definition its not luxury imho
              although you could argue that it is, its entirely up to how you want to see it.

              to me ccp is not luxury, artisanalwear is not luxury to me, perhaps you could argue dressing in a very inconvenient way is a sign of wealth but that does not make it luxury imho (take a woman wearing a marc le bihan dress as an example)
              Originally posted by unwashed
              Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
              Originally posted by Ahimsa
              I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

              Comment

              • Anton
                Senior Member
                • Oct 2014
                • 261

                Originally posted by Monoral View Post
                What is a luxury brand nowadays? Is it material used or the brand name/legacy?
                Or is it mainly social media hype?
                Today? It's a brand that is perceived to be luxury. It has very little to do with the actual quality of garments unfortunately. Faust mentioned PR and advertisement budget, which is definitely a major factor. If you can buy your way in, or you just know the right people you can pretty much establish (create hype) your brand as whatever you want (in this case luxury) with a total disregard to basic fundamentals in the category you're trying to enter. Artisanal brands also experience this to a certain extent, but since the overall audience is smaller you have less of this.

                Traditional luxury is, in my opinion, all about quality and excess, price point, history and consistency and some other factors. With artisanal brands the aesthetic, unique production and materials and process are much more important.
                I love beautiful melodies, telling me terrible things.
                My Music: https://soundcloud.com/iamanton

                Comment

                • Nickefuge
                  Senior Member
                  • Nov 2014
                  • 860

                  Does anybody know when Balenciaga will present their garbs?
                  Really excited for more ridiculously priced ironic working-class appreciation.
                  "The only rule is don't be boring and dress cute wherever you go. Life is too short to blend in."
                  -Paris Hilton

                  Comment

                  • Faust
                    kitsch killer
                    • Sep 2006
                    • 37852

                    Originally posted by Nickefuge View Post
                    Does anybody know when Balenciaga will present their garbs?
                    Really excited for more ridiculously priced ironic working-class appreciation.
                    Why, Vetements at a McDonalds was not enough for you?
                    Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                    StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                    Comment

                    • Nomadic Planet
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2012
                      • 229

                      Originally posted by TriggerDiscipline View Post
                      sure, but by traditional definition its not luxury imho
                      although you could argue that it is, its entirely up to how you want to see it.

                      to me ccp is not luxury, artisanalwear is not luxury to me, perhaps you could argue dressing in a very inconvenient way is a sign of wealth but that does not make it luxury imho (take a woman wearing a marc le bihan dress as an example)
                      I really want to buy your opinion but I'm really struggling to... how can CCP not be luxury , with the huge amount of technicity, jackets and footwear costing more than most people monthly income... cmon man...
                      it is a different version of luxury. Yes, initially luxury was about perfection, like Hermès, but with the evolution of society, the inflation and saturation of options in the market, the ambivalence of what really makes the value of a garment (are LV bags at 400€ really luxury???) etc., the value of luxury progressively moves into the immaterial dimension: rarity, concept, uniqueness of each piece, etc. (to the sad point where a Vêtement hoodie or tee can be seen as luxury, not for the item itself, but for the idea it carries)

                      CCP is the epitome of luxury in the sense that it's a brand that can afford the luxury to not give a fuck about perfection.

                      Artisanal brands are all about that too. LUC sweaters at 800€, etc. Luxury is not dissociable from price. Price is obviously not the only factor that qualifies it as luxury, but could luxury be really luxury if it cost ... an affordable price ??? (obv not)

                      Comment

                      • Nomadic Planet
                        Senior Member
                        • Dec 2012
                        • 229

                        Originally posted by Nickefuge View Post
                        Does anybody know when Balenciaga will present their garbs?
                        Really excited for more ridiculously priced ironic working-class appreciation.
                        Originally posted by Faust View Post
                        Why, Vetements at a McDonalds was not enough for you?
                        is there a legitimate way (and an unlegitimate way) to do "working-class / poor" aesthetics in luxury?
                        Because I don't see brands like LUC get roasted because they do hobo aesthetics.

                        or this new brand called KLOSHAR, which in French literally means "homeless person" (correct spelling "clochard") picked up by Wolfensson, PNP; ArchiveSF, among others...

                        I got nothing against the artisanal LUC (or similar brand) aesthetics - it's even rather my thing obvs otherwise I wouldn't be hanging around this forum - but I have to confess seeing a brand named KLOSHAR does make me feel uncomfortable, like it's really reaching the limits of the ethically acceptable... is that homelessness appreciation? Ironic homelessness appreciation? literal homelessness appreciation? what's the point of calling a "luxury" brand literally "hobo" ?

                        EDIT: unless "kloshar" really means something else in another language which I ignore, my first reaction, when seeing the aesthetics is to think they made a play on the french word "clochard"
                        Last edited by Nomadic Planet; 07-07-2019, 03:04 PM.

                        Comment

                        • TriggerDiscipline
                          Senior Member
                          • Apr 2013
                          • 859

                          Originally posted by Nomadic Planet View Post
                          I really want to buy your opinion but I'm really struggling to... how can CCP not be luxury , with the huge amount of technicity, jackets and footwear costing more than most people monthly income... cmon man...
                          it is a different version of luxury. Yes, initially luxury was about perfection, like Hermès, but with the evolution of society, the inflation and saturation of options in the market, the ambivalence of what really makes the value of a garment (are LV bags at 400€ really luxury???) etc., the value of luxury progressively moves into the immaterial dimension: rarity, concept, uniqueness of each piece, etc. (to the sad point where a Vêtement hoodie or tee can be seen as luxury, not for the item itself, but for the idea it carries)

                          CCP is the epitome of luxury in the sense that it's a brand that can afford the luxury to not give a fuck about perfection.

                          Artisanal brands are all about that too. LUC sweaters at 800€, etc. Luxury is not dissociable from price. Price is obviously not the only factor that qualifies it as luxury, but could luxury be really luxury if it cost ... an affordable price ??? (obv not)
                          idk man i guess agree to disagree, I dont see price as an indication of anything, i dont think deconstruction is luxury, i dont see *imperfections* as a luxury, not even as a countermovement to what was going on in the 2000s.

                          you can say it is and accept that, but to me its just designer clothing
                          Originally posted by unwashed
                          Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                          Originally posted by Ahimsa
                          I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                          Comment

                          • TriggerDiscipline
                            Senior Member
                            • Apr 2013
                            • 859

                            actually you havent specifically said what is lux about ccp?

                            everyone here is comparing rolls royces with artisanally reconstructed vintage porches or something like that.


                            also loewe could be considered *luxury workwear*
                            Originally posted by unwashed
                            Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                            Originally posted by Ahimsa
                            I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                            Comment

                            • Nickefuge
                              Senior Member
                              • Nov 2014
                              • 860

                              Personally, when thinking about this whole topic, I make this differentiation between luxurious and artisanal products: is an item made the best way possible without being "extra" or is it a fabulous, extravagant version of an item that could’ve been made in a simpler way? The first one, to me, falls into the realms of artisanal clothing while the latter is definitely luxury. Of course the borders between the two are fluid.

                              @Nomadic Planet: Naming your brand KLOSHAR is a disrespectful dick move, no question about that. If this was a streetwear brand called "HOMMELE$$", everyone would be freaking out. But hey, it’s niche and expensive, so I guess the backlash within the rich eccentric community will be minimal.

                              The line between dystopian/nomadic aesthetics and the homeless look is thin, but seeing as most homeless people wear regular clothes (sweatshirts, jeans, sneakers) rather than layeres upon layers of torn and draped fabric, the homeless image brands like LUC kind of emulate are from another century – this is why KLOSHAR would be unproblematic if it had another name (I mean their hats do look like Horisaki or Reinhard Plank after all).

                              Vetements and Balenciaga copy the "poor man’s" look of our times, that’s why they’re problematic. Especially Vetements, who are not even doing a proper collection but rather a showcase of different cosplays …
                              "The only rule is don't be boring and dress cute wherever you go. Life is too short to blend in."
                              -Paris Hilton

                              Comment

                              • TriggerDiscipline
                                Senior Member
                                • Apr 2013
                                • 859

                                Originally posted by Nickefuge View Post
                                the homeless image brands like LUC …
                                I can assure you this is not the intention whatsoever


                                putting all these brands under the artisanal povera box and bunching them all together really detracts from the individual intent of each brand
                                Originally posted by unwashed
                                Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                                Originally posted by Ahimsa
                                I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X
                                😀
                                🥰
                                🤢
                                😎
                                😡
                                👍
                                👎