random fashion thoughts

[DudleyGray]

I can understand experimenting and experiments not working out. How can you know what you like most unless you explore your curiosities? But on the other hand, jumping from aesthetic to aesthetic really seems counter to SZ. At a certain point, it's just fast fashion mindset bleeding into designer level clothing. It's not much better than buying/disposing of H&M season after season for the next look, it just has larger start-up cost.

[Faust]

I wouldn't be so quick to put the blame for fleeting tastes on the shoulders of fast fashion. Designer fashion has always been about trends, adapting looks, what's in or out. The ethos of SZ is to subvert these notions. It's not a coincidence that we like many designers whose work has continuity (Ann, Rick, Yohji).

[TriggerDiscipline]

I dont see what is the problem with hopping onto the new season, the 2008-10 Rick Owens `look` has people on here dreadfully bored. I believe (IMHO) that even within the basics there is an evolved look to it (2015). what is wrong with selling your old stuff and buying the newer stuff?

some brands evolve faster than others, and if youre a fan/patron/supporter/fanatic why would you not want to be onto the next look.

I am having a hard time understanding how someone like Rick or a brand specifically like Julius which from resonance forward the look changed, and now with the new SS16 the look is going to yet again change; not be* designer fashion*?

why is there need to disconnect from the brand?

[TriggerDiscipline]

True--I suppose when I think of fashion and its consumers I tend to think of collectors rather than trend-followers, even if it's not "sz fashion" we're talking about--those just tend to be the people I get on with better/hang around with more.

I agree with the notion of collecting, but to me some things have more collectors value than other things, in my case layer-0 , carol , deepti. things with either hand made detailing or some sort of technological value where on a global scale is to me perceived(my own not what other people think) as more rare, versus more fashion/fashionable brands. I have no issues with people collecting that either though.

[Faust]

I dont see what is the problem with hopping onto the new season, the 2008-10 Rick Owens `look` has people on here dreadfully bored. I believe (IMHO) that even within the basics there is an evolved look to it (2015). what is wrong with selling your old stuff and buying the newer stuff?

some brands evolve faster than others, and if youre a fan/patron/supporter/fanatic why would you not want to be onto the next look.

I am having a hard time understanding how someone like Rick or a brand specifically like Julius which from resonance forward the look changed, and now with the new SS16 the look is going to yet again change; not be* designer fashion*?

why is there need to disconnect from the brand?

That's not what we are talking about at all

[DudleyGray]

I wouldn't blame fast fashion, but it's just a good descriptor of a certain mindset. To change aesthetics dramatically, frequently, and in a short period of time but also publicly, I think it reveals a desperate desire for admiration. Although I'm probably not one to be throwing stones, I don't exactly have the healthiest buying habits, haha.

[Faust]

Somewhat related, but as I am reading old essays, say from the 60s writing about the 40s, quoting writers from the 1870s, not much has changed - masses and mass culture were always abhorrent to (wo)men who thought. Narcissism was always rampant. It's just we have new tools to express the vileness of our culture, fashion included, so maybe it seems worse to us.

[yay]

Well it is the age of information overload, pretty much means everything seems like a supercharged version of itself

[Fuuma]

Everything's fine:

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2015/04/17/the-rising-power-of-social-media-influencers-documentary/

[Faust]

It's from Copenhagen. Doesn't count.

[Fuuma]

It's from Copenhagen. Doesn't count.

I love the part where pr-trend-whatevershedoes girl has her sidekick sitting next to her and nodding to everything she says. The little Paris montage of hype shops/place shown in a few seconds is also great marketing wankery. Most people know their job is ridiculous and lame but marketing and fashion people share with actors and apps-pushers the delusion that their activity isn't a sad pool of nothingness.

[Scander]

Is avant-garde still an useful category? And anti-fashion exists? Where?

I mean, for me is already difficult to talk about avant-garde and avant-gardism about the work of the japanese in early '80 or Margiela's work. Maybe only to distinguish a certain style or way of working? Anti-fashion also, maybe worst then "avant-garde" - because "avant-garde" brings with it a certain type of signification -, because those designers anyway showed their works in the same ways - catwalks, interview, magazines etc. I see fashion as a system which eats everything that happens in its territory and a motion of deterritorialization is extremely hard. - I think CCP in the same space with MMM and japanese because of the way of showing the works so, another time, catwalks, interviews, appearances on mainstream magazines etc. (sure the quality and quantity is different but the spaces are the same imo) -.
Altieri's work is a bit different only because there weren't interviews and magazines appearances - maybe purple e co. was too busy with Margiela and Lang? Maybe he doesn't really found a way to communicate his work instead of just refusing it? - and he only showed their work at the X18, San Martino in Campo etc. but also form him I would not talk about avant-garde or anti-fashion. I prefer talking about pushing the limits of fashion system and its rules. I prefer talking in terms of an athletic movement instead using a category that maybe a designer like him doesn't really appreciate.

I see more life in those terms.

What do you think?

[DudleyGray]

I don't think it is really a category or genre so much as a descriptor that is highly contextual. In the 70s and 80s, the Ramones made rebellious music. But their music isn't rebellious anymore, because the context has changed. I wouldn't use rebellious as a music genre though, and I wouldn't call avant garde a style of clothing. Although unlike "rebellious," I have a hard time thinking of what avant garde signifies, except that when I see it, I think it looks fucked up in some wonderful way and it makes my heart drop into my stomach.

[Scander]

I don't think it is really a category or genre so much as a descriptor that is highly contextual. In the 70s and 80s, the Ramones made rebellious music. But their music isn't rebellious anymore, because the context has changed. I wouldn't use rebellious as a music genre though, and I wouldn't call avant garde a style of clothing. Although unlike "rebellious," I have a hard time thinking of what avant garde signifies, except that when I see it, I think it looks fucked up in some wonderful way and it makes my heart drop into my stomach.

Beautiful image.

I understand the distinction you are making and I agree.

[Faust]

I love the part where pr-trend-whatevershedoes girl has her sidekick sitting next to her and nodding to everything she says. The little Paris montage of hype shops/place shown in a few seconds is also great marketing wankery. Most people know their job is ridiculous and lame but marketing and fashion people share with actors and apps-pushers the delusion that their activity isn't a sad pool of nothingness.

Church