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  • TriggerDiscipline
    Senior Member
    • Apr 2013
    • 859

    I'm not really sure what you're talking about, bbs has had more mishaps than Rick in my purchases, because the quality control is higher due to production size. I've seen tons of imperfections or shit that would be considered unsellable by Japanese standards (if that matters for anyone) on bbs, the last pair of fw15 pants I bought has a fucked up part where the stitch on what is considered the belt portion has a stitch that has deviated from the pattern on it that they felt it was okay to sell. does it bother me? no not really but for someone who has ocd tendencies, they might be inclined to return the item.
    Originally posted by unwashed
    Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
    Originally posted by Ahimsa
    I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

    Comment

    • Arkady
      Senior Member
      • Apr 2011
      • 957

      Construction quality and imperfections / misshaps that are part of the production process are separate things, no? Tag's got an entire essay about it on there.

      I haven't compared full production runs but BBS has been more solidly and durably put together than Rick from similar time frames and price points, among my purchases. I'm not necessarily talking about small issues that are theoretically part of their "experimental" process.

      I've definitely heard the pants can be bizarrely delicate for BBS -- don't own any myself.

      Comment

      • TriggerDiscipline
        Senior Member
        • Apr 2013
        • 859

        what I'm trying to say is that a company like Rick has less leeway as to what is considered sellable compared to bbs, but I think bbs will catch up in time, I'm told the operation is getting bigger seasonally and their standards have been changing which is obviously evident if youve handled old bbs and new bbs.
        Originally posted by unwashed
        Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
        Originally posted by Ahimsa
        I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

        Comment

        • Faust
          kitsch killer
          • Sep 2006
          • 37852

          Indeed, they are!
          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

          Comment

          • Arkady
            Senior Member
            • Apr 2011
            • 957

            Originally posted by TriggerDiscipline View Post
            what I'm trying to say is that a company like Rick has less leeway as to what is considered sellable compared to bbs, but I think bbs will catch up in time, I'm told the operation is getting bigger seasonally and their standards have been changing which is obviously evident if youve handled old bbs and new bbs.
            True but I think the margin is different due to different philosophies, I'm not sure if an experimental artisanal brand allowing for imperfections is a quality control issue. I get what you mean though.

            Comment

            • TriggerDiscipline
              Senior Member
              • Apr 2013
              • 859

              sorry I don't agree, if you have a seam and you're looking at the chart of operations and it calls for 10cm and it goes off by 1.5cm for the length of half the pant then it should be redone, that's not really excusable for me. this has nothing to do with experiments or artisanal work. especially when I have the same pant from a different season and its not as messed up as this pant.

              the issue is that this went through the person responsible, the factory quality control, and the retailer meaning the standards are clearly looser than a global large scale operation that is Rick Owens

              and philosophically I get what youre trying to say but bbs is far from a "deconstructed" "raw hems" etc kind of brand in 2015, he put models on the runway with jackets inside out with pride over construction techniques
              Originally posted by unwashed
              Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
              Originally posted by Ahimsa
              I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

              Comment

              • Lex1017
                Senior Member
                • Jul 2015
                • 175

                Originally posted by TriggerDiscipline View Post
                sorry I don't agree, if you have a seam and you're looking at the chart of operations and it calls for 10cm and it goes off by 1.5cm for the length of half the pant then it should be redone, that's not really excusable for me. this has nothing to do with experiments or artisanal work. especially when I have the same pant from a different season and its not as messed up as this pant.

                the issue is that this went through the person responsible, the factory quality control, and the retailer meaning the standards are clearly looser than a global large scale operation that is Rick Owens

                and philosophically I get what youre trying to say but bbs is far from a "deconstructed" "raw hems" etc kind of brand in 2015, he put models on the runway with jackets inside out with pride over construction techniques
                I think if it compromises the construction and overall strength/durability of the piece then of course that needs to be re-done. I don't want to speak for Arkady but I THINK he might mean that seeing an aspect of human interaction on a piece gives it life. A slightly imperfect seam line or a back tacked thread not cut to microscopic perfection shows someone worked with that piece, handled it. People are not perfect. Clothing that is pristine and perfect is cool, but seems a little mechanical, impersonal maybe. The piece has no character. To me these slight imperfections also make the piece "mine". Whenever I scuff my shoes or have to fix some of my clothes myself, it becomes my own. No one else has one like it. I love that corny shit.

                Comment

                • TriggerDiscipline
                  Senior Member
                  • Apr 2013
                  • 859

                  clothes is made with a ton of handwork in it, you still need people to cut things by hand (and I'm not talking about the actual garments, just like things that need to be cut like the extra canvassing of a jacket and such) and set things by hand, and actually push the fabric to create garments. when you're paying premium dollar for something you expect the quality that comes with it. if we are going to talk margins, the cost of operations for bbs is higher due to the size of the company. in a basic sense the smaller the production/company the price has a higher percentage of having a higher price. there are brands who decide to begin to run their own fabric creation or production facilities because you're cutting out a middle man.

                  so with this being said in the case of bbs they are supposedly doing everything themselves (maybe they source fabric but the rest is done in their own location)

                  when the production is this close to home they should have more control over their product vs paying to have their garments made by an outside source where they might have to dish out serious cash to give the care they could give themselves. so for example at the end of production every garment gets a press/ iron that step could be skipped to cut costs and they could do it when it is recieved by the designer, etc.

                  it could be because that factory more to risk (reputation for example) they have tighter standards.

                  on the bbs tag it does say hand made but it doesn't say carefully hand made, although this is one example of out of all the bbs I've bought in the last two seasons, the rest hasn't had major problems besides straps on a vest bag.

                  I will say that all of the seams with piping and stuff is way better than alot of the pants I've bought in the past, and it is done rather well, just wished they had tighter standards when it comes to quality control.
                  Originally posted by unwashed
                  Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                  Originally posted by Ahimsa
                  I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                  Comment

                  • aussy
                    Senior Member
                    • Jul 2011
                    • 555

                    'Artisanal' touches are one thing, but Trigger is talking about a larger deviation, one that would affect fit and not just cosmetics. That inconsistency was obviously not intentional so it should be seen as that, an error, instead of romantic and excusable evidence of human work.

                    Comment

                    • TriggerDiscipline
                      Senior Member
                      • Apr 2013
                      • 859

                      Originally posted by aussy View Post
                      'Artisanal' touches are one thing, but Trigger is talking about a larger deviation, one that would affect fit and not just cosmetics. That inconsistency was obviously not intentional so it should be seen as that, an error, instead of romantic and excusable evidence of human work.
                      I had just explained that clothing is human work, am I miss-communicating here? even fast fashion has human hands on it... there is no automation, things are still made by workers, if they weren't then there would be no ethical issues concerning bangladesh etc anywhere because automation
                      Originally posted by unwashed
                      Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                      Originally posted by Ahimsa
                      I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                      Comment

                      • aussy
                        Senior Member
                        • Jul 2011
                        • 555

                        Uhh, I didn't say anything that implied otherwise. My post was in response to Lex's and Puck's which to me read as dismissing your experience as one inherent to the nature of the garment rather than an issue with qc.

                        Comment

                        • TriggerDiscipline
                          Senior Member
                          • Apr 2013
                          • 859

                          Originally posted by aussy View Post
                          Uhh, I didn't say anything that implied otherwise. My post was in response to Lex's and Puck's which to me read as dismissing your experience as one inherent to the nature of the garment rather than an issue with qc.
                          yeah as in, you understand what i'm trying to say but they don't for some reason
                          Originally posted by unwashed
                          Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                          Originally posted by Ahimsa
                          I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                          Comment

                          • upsilonkng
                            Senior Member
                            • May 2010
                            • 874

                            why are u so aggressive? even when someone is agreeing w/ u , ur combative???

                            Comment

                            • TriggerDiscipline
                              Senior Member
                              • Apr 2013
                              • 859

                              no, I wasn't trying to be combative lol, miscommunication in a post about miscommunication I was referring to their post, and asking aussy if my writing doesn't make sense
                              Originally posted by unwashed
                              Try to use a phone camera in broad daylight or use a proper camera.
                              Originally posted by Ahimsa
                              I've found it extremely pleasant and enthralling over repeated whiffs so I would highly recommend.

                              Comment

                              • 13we2
                                Senior Member
                                • Sep 2015
                                • 226

                                Originally posted by aussy View Post
                                'Artisanal' touches are one thing, but Trigger is talking about a larger deviation, one that would affect fit and not just cosmetics. That inconsistency was obviously not intentional so it should be seen as that, an error, instead of romantic and excusable evidence of human work.
                                Then it'd be quite difficult to define what's really "intentional". You guys haven't thought about those works by BBS' master.

                                Comment

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