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How Context Changes Meaning

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  • Faust
    kitsch killer
    • Sep 2006
    • 37852

    #16
    Originally posted by stagename View Post
    Sounds like co-optation theory 101 at first, but what I like is that this brings forth that co-optation can have multiple waves, eg from 1928 schott to Hollywood to pop music to high fashion to hip hop to fuccbois. That's 85 years. If I followed your historicization correctly. I don't have any theory on hand to talk about waves of co-optation, and how the item retains subversive meanings while fitting in with the existing cultural orders to allow for such a long continuous existing and ability to be plugged in so many different, hum, assemblages. Seems it got co-opted and then re-appropriated by subversive subcultures and re-coopted and ... Got me thinking. There might be something to do with this.
    Originally posted by Nickefuge View Post
    I’ve been skating since 1999 and while I do comprehend how some skateboarders are offended by everyone and their mom appropriating skateboarding culture, I just can’t summon the energy to get mad about it. Skateboarding’s popularity has been up and down over the last decades and the trend will eventually fade away just like it has before.
    The central point of the article is how adaptation or co-optation changes meaning or destroys it altogether, which seems to be the case in the latest co-optation wave. In the case of the perfecto, I don't think adaptation had a negative effect. Although some bikers could have rightfully said that if you've never ridden a motorcycle you have no business of owning one, I do think that the spirit of rebellion was left close to its original meaning. But the latest co-optation is a mere fashion statement, empty of meaning.
    Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

    StyleZeitgeist Magazine

    Comment

    • Nickefuge
      Senior Member
      • Nov 2014
      • 860

      #17
      Well, a lot of garments are derived from workwear, uniforms etc. so not co-opting anything at all would be quite a task.
      "The only rule is don't be boring and dress cute wherever you go. Life is too short to blend in."
      -Paris Hilton

      Comment

      • stagename
        Senior Member
        • Oct 2011
        • 497

        #18
        Originally posted by Faust View Post
        ...the latest co-optation is a mere fashion statement, empty of meaning.
        But that`s the whole point of co-optation, it suppresses subversive meanings of subcultural innovations to (in a consumption setting) please the mainstream/middle-class tastes, eg tattoos, punk culture.

        Comment

        • Faust
          kitsch killer
          • Sep 2006
          • 37852

          #19
          Originally posted by stagename View Post
          But that`s the whole point of co-optation, it suppresses subversive meanings of subcultural innovations to (in a consumption setting) please the mainstream/middle-class tastes, eg tattoos, punk culture.
          Right, I was trying to differentiate between appropriation and co-optation. I'm with you.
          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

          Comment

          • stagename
            Senior Member
            • Oct 2011
            • 497

            #20
            Originally posted by Faust View Post
            Right, I was trying to differentiate between appropriation and co-optation. I'm with you.
            Never tried this. Here goes my weekend. ;)

            Comment

            • casem
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2006
              • 2590

              #21
              I hate it but have to agree with Faust. I'd like to wear what I like without acknowledging the outside world, but no one lives in a bubble and context changes the meaning of things. The only item I have that falls into this category is my Rick prisoner sweats, I don't wear them as much as I'd like because I see so many guys in droopy sweats walking around NYC lately. The only way out is to wear it in a different way from the hypebeasts, I'll only wear them with some tailoring and heavy boots to keep it from looking like the ubiquitous droopy sweats look plaguing our streets.
              music

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              • Nickh949
                Junior Member
                • Apr 2014
                • 10

                #22
                dont think anyone who actually rides bikes where im from in CA even wear perfecto's. i kinda see it as a novelty for the weekend warrior here. As far as the kids in Silicon Valley, well....

                the most fitting ive seen wearing them lately are folks in Japan, except in Langlitz.

                Comment

                • upsilonkng
                  Senior Member
                  • May 2010
                  • 874

                  #23
                  u dont see people wearing perfecto's in LA? thats crazy, do u ever go downtown at night in bars or go to silverlake parties or really any bigger or smaller show? its pretty much standard for boys and girls

                  Comment

                  • Nickh949
                    Junior Member
                    • Apr 2014
                    • 10

                    #24
                    you're right, actually. Its really trendy right now no doubt. i just automatically have a filter for those who bear the article disingenuously (which i think we can agree is easy for some to depict). I feel like the Labels who do produce the perfecto under the lense of those who converse here, and perhaps with the same general spirit(?) even dare i say hype territory are fewer and farther in between.

                    but i will admit i have not been out much since i laid my bike down two or so years ago.

                    with that said i dont know too many people who do ride on a regular basis sporting a Perfecto.

                    Comment

                    • Nickefuge
                      Senior Member
                      • Nov 2014
                      • 860

                      #25
                      Biking has kept up with the times, so bikers wear high tech gear now that will protect them far better than a perfecto ever could. The perfecto has ironically transformed into a fashion garment and completely detached from its actual purpose.
                      "The only rule is don't be boring and dress cute wherever you go. Life is too short to blend in."
                      -Paris Hilton

                      Comment

                      • stagename
                        Senior Member
                        • Oct 2011
                        • 497

                        #26
                        Originally posted by Nickefuge View Post
                        The [garment] has ironically transformed into a fashion garment and completely detached from its actual purpose.
                        I feel half the history of fashion can be summarized with this.

                        Comment

                        • Faust
                          kitsch killer
                          • Sep 2006
                          • 37852

                          #27
                          Originally posted by stagename View Post
                          Never tried this. Here goes my weekend. ;)
                          Haha, I'm looking forward to your analysis!
                          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                          Comment

                          • Faust
                            kitsch killer
                            • Sep 2006
                            • 37852

                            #28
                            Originally posted by stagename View Post
                            I feel half the history of fashion can be summarized with this.
                            True - I would say the trench coat is an even better example of what Nickfudge says about perfectos.
                            Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                            StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                            Comment

                            • negroygris
                              Senior Member
                              • Aug 2013
                              • 270

                              #29
                              Originally posted by Faust View Post
                              True - I would say the trench coat is an even better example of what Nickfudge says about perfectos.

                              Indeed, the trench coat is at the top, but I also think technical vests (utility vests) have become an everyday perfecto.
                              We hope that people will begin to see beyond the superficial surface of things and understand that there is far more to a design than just the way it looks on the outside.

                              -GEOFFREY B. SMALL

                              Comment

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