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  • JaridRose
    Member
    • Jan 2007
    • 50

    Forme D'expression




    Thoughts?




    Photo from pollyanna. The FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N websiteis www.factoryofaith.com




    I like it but not sure how legit it all is.





  • Faust
    kitsch killer
    • Sep 2006
    • 37852

    #2
    Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



    Thanks, Jarid. We briefly discussed this in the SS07 Arrivals and Reviews in the shopping section. I think we came more or less to the conclusion that we are starting to get a little tired to all these CDiem clones, and this concept is really overwrought and ephemeral, hinging on a name, but not much else.



    I saw some stuff at the Library in London, and it was nice, and very expensive, and I wondered if the whole inverted arte povera thing is becoming a fad and people are starting to go in in order to cash out.



    Honestly, between



    CDiem + all the family



    Poell



    Paul Harnden



    Casey-Vidalenc



    Gary Graham



    Pechoo + Krejberg



    and a ton of Japanese labels that stomp, stress, bury, piss, and run the clothes over by a truck to make it look poor, I am starting to question the authenticity of purpose here.



    Just my thoughts. What do you think?

    Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

    StyleZeitgeist Magazine

    Comment

    • explicit
      Member
      • Jan 2007
      • 90

      #3
      Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



      i tend to agree, faust. it seems to me to be, like with most other innovative situations, that the initial spark is diluted by other groups seeking to cash in on a developing aesthetic.



      i believe, with ccp and cdiem, that there is indeed a sort of purity of thought inherent to the development of the lines. as has been discussed elswhere, there's an artisanal approach and a philosophy behind the design. however, as the 'stealth wealth' movement continues to develop (and to move from a smaller, reactionary force to a full-fledged fashion/lifestyle movement) it's only natural that other designers would, in effect, hope to 'ride the coattails' of these forerunners, especially now that the waters have been sufficiently tested.



      so, while i do hope that there is a sense of authenticity within these newer lines that are working within the playground, so to speak, set forth by the likes of the aforementioned, i think i'll have to be cautious and wait to see if anything actually 'new' arises.

      Comment

      • JaridRose
        Member
        • Jan 2007
        • 50

        #4
        Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



        Well, Im not too familiar with Carpe Diem as much as I would like to be, I guess because of the lack of info out there....but from what I have seen and know I LOVE c.d.




        I too try not to buy, or get lost in the image of brands that seem to have no purpose besides money or giving people that new thing, etc...




        But when I see brands like this form, etc. I can't help but think that they can't be making that much money, the audience isnt that large, and if they were phonies they could easily be doing something else...




        But at the same time alot of these designers who rip off other designers do it because that's what they like....




        I mean, Ilove Margiela for some reason but he's not exactly "that great" anymore, and hasnt been really in my eyes...Look at CDG. It started as something different and "real" and now look at Dover Street Market and the last few collections!! What is happening?!?




        So when I see something like Form< i think, "Well, none of my "old favs" seem to be doing it anymore, so what the heck, I guess I'll buy it."




        I really like the blazer up at the top of the page and it's mostly because these old favs seem to be going in a different direction.....




        more money, commercialized, less of a "purpose". I mean success begins to become about that $$...




        But the bottom line for me is for some reason these new people and re-hashed designers will never give me that impact that CDG or Margiela or Rick did and always will for some odd reason when they really hit me...




        I even look at people like Jun Takahashi, and like his Undercover stuff in a way but think "Man, this guy is really some graphic design type who is doing clothes, riding coattails..." and to me its not AS great as someone like Rei and never will be no matter what the guy does...




        same with form and all the other "little guys"....




        but like I said, as far as style goes, i really like the BLAZER and can't really find another one that i like TOO much more, it's up there. crazy i know.

        Comment

        • Faust
          kitsch killer
          • Sep 2006
          • 37852

          #5
          Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



          Jarid, I totally understand. I also like to see fresh blood in the design field, it's an ever evolving enterprise. But, like you said, one needs to have a lot of information in mind in order to differentiate the real deal from the hype.



          As far as money, it's a relative subject. What's a lot for Cdiem, is not a lot for Margiela, what's a lot for Margiela, is not a lot for Gucci, what's a lot for Gucci is not a lot for Gap.

          Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

          StyleZeitgeist Magazine

          Comment

          • unmetro
            Member
            • Sep 2006
            • 93

            #6
            Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N

            [quote user="Faust"]


            ...this concept is really overwrought and ephemeral, hinging on a name, but not much else...the whole inverted arte povera thing is becoming a fad and people are starting to go in in order to cash out...a ton of [Japanese] labels that stomp, stress, bury, piss, and run the clothes over by a truck to make it look poor, I am starting to question the authenticity of purpose here.




            [/quote]





            hmm...where does everyone see this all heading then? without sounding too "trendy", evidently "something" new(or old made new again) will take the spotlight (soon?)...who would you say ison the fringe of artistic interpretation and design?



            Comment

            • Faust
              kitsch killer
              • Sep 2006
              • 37852

              #7
              Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N

              I don't know, but I am sure we will recognize it when it comes. [:D]
              Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

              StyleZeitgeist Magazine

              Comment

              • JaridRose
                Member
                • Jan 2007
                • 50

                #8
                Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                I honestly have no idea...The world is SO crazy right now as far as art and fashion and the times....




                Andy Warhol did what he did THEN and could NEVER do it in this day and age...




                As much as I hate to say it I have been thinking about it for some time and I think the last person to really hit the entire fashion industry big, including the "underground" was Tom Ford for Gucci.




                I think he hit the money, the commercial success, the somewhat great fabrics, the "vision", the EVERYTHING, and even people on the lower food chain that love artsy fartsy stuff have to give the man respect and overall like what he did.... That's My opinion though, it took me awhile to like gucci and tom, believe me....




                But to me, Fashion is fashion because of the big ones....there is BY FAR the most GARBAGE in the commercial market, but well you know...




                The thing is, without Advertising and with "no fashion show" and no "models with names" the "underground" will NEVER come up, because thats what makes it underground....sorry bout all the quotations.




                My point is, even now, the "underground" has certain "rules" it now has to follow in order to be seen as "legit".....I mean, we like CDiem better than Forme for some reason, but why? and what about two years from now?




                I think it is for one reason and one reason only, no matter how much designers want to their clothes to NOT BE ABOUT CLOTHES or BE ABOUT CLOTHES, it never is and never isnt.




                its all lost somewhere...until someone makes it About the Clothes, plain and simple 100 percent, or Not About The Clothes 100 percent we will continue to see a million so-sos.

                Comment

                • Faust
                  kitsch killer
                  • Sep 2006
                  • 37852

                  #9
                  Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                  Funny, ALL ABOUT THE CLOTHES is kind of what I am writing my Masters thesis on. The intersection of making the garment and the concept is fascinating. I can say that Margiela is one of the most conceptual designers ever, and at the same time, he is ALL ABOUT CLOTHES, from the pure white label, to refusal of taking the sold credit for work, to every last experimental stitch. I can say the same thing about CDiem - their concepts, however esoteric they may seem at times are ALL ABOUT THE CLOTHES. The garment becomes the center through time-consuming and painstaking work.



                  As far as your other remarks, I think you are hitting on fashion history a bit, and that's important. I think one needs to know one's history if he wants to be serious about creating in a public realm. Maybe that's where the "rules" come in. But I'm not sure that PR is everything these days - the right magazines, the right models, etc. Look at Cloak - it is absolutely undeniable that the label hit it off with an amazing collection - people are still hunting for FW04 items and some are willing to pay over retail. To write off the pure process of design is like surrendering.



                  Tom Ford probably was the last guy to do something important, whether we like it or not. I think that Hedi may have done something similar - the jury's out on that.

                  Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                  StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                  Comment

                  • JaridRose
                    Member
                    • Jan 2007
                    • 50

                    #10
                    Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                    Well it's funny that you mention Hedi, because he is in that same type of thing..




                    Cloak is a good example because to me, he was talented, he had a little money behind it, etc. But somehow it failed! Seeing Cloak "fail", is pretty discouraging to me, someone who wants to at least do something one day. I mean, he had more money behind that thing than i could ever want for a first few collections type thing, but somehow it didnt work for him.....




                    I have to say though, in Margiela's case he "pretends to be about the clothes" to me. The reason why i like margiela isnt because of the actual garments but because of my image of margiela.....The whole, no photos, no interviews type thing....the way his videos are shot, the way he is artistic in shooting his clothes and fashion shows. He is very creative but really moreso when its not with clothes, when he is collaborating with others, and trying to force this mysterious image and "im about the clothes, so you cant see me" type thing...Yes, i like his clothes too, but if he was flamboyant gay man and starring in action adventure movies or something it would be a whole new ballgame.




                    I mean, look at Lagerfeld. Good guy, but his image is the clothes too....




                    Would CDIEM still be "all about the clothes" if they were making something with prints? or if they made jeans with sequins on them?



                    Comment

                    • Faust
                      kitsch killer
                      • Sep 2006
                      • 37852

                      #11
                      Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                      About Cloak, I am convinced from Alex's cursory remarks that he is shutting down shop because of contractual reasons. Something must've happened either between him and Geller, or someone else.



                      Well, I can say for myself that Margiela's persona does not attract me at all. Ann's does much more. I'd like to chat with her at dinner, not so much with Margiela.



                      I don't know what I'd think of CDiem making jeans with swarovski bling on them - probably the same thing I think about Juicy Couture. That's why when people ask me to admire Rei Kawakubo about putting the Rolling Stones logo on her suits, because she is so conceptual or subversive or whatever, I just shrug. How come people don't admire, say Buddhist Punk - they also put Rolling Stones logo on their shirts...

                      Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                      StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                      Comment

                      • justine
                        Senior Member
                        • Jan 2007
                        • 672

                        #12
                        Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N

                        I think I saw the same thing totally rolled up on the floor in the corner of my closet in the 'give to the salvation army' section ...



                        Seriously, I'd like to know what's so great about this piece. Judging from the picture only, it's a big huge bleh!...

                        Comment

                        • JaridRose
                          Member
                          • Jan 2007
                          • 50

                          #13
                          Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                          I was homless for three months in L.A.....




                          So i guess that's why i love salvation army type stuff.




                          seriously.....and i've always loved old-school deconstruction, and to me, that's what this reminds me of.

                          Comment

                          • Faust
                            kitsch killer
                            • Sep 2006
                            • 37852

                            #14
                            Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N

                            [quote user="JaridRose"]

                            I was homless for three months in L.A.....




                            So i guess that's why i love salvation army type stuff.




                            seriously.....and i've always loved old-school deconstruction, and to me, that's what this reminds me of.



                            [/quote]



                            In that case I wanted to ask, completely sincerely - do you get offended when you see the inverted arte povera thing? As explicit pointed out, the whole idea of rich people trying to look poor? Personally, CDiem, etc. in many instances does not look like that, but sometimes it does. That's why those super beat up $700 Margiela shoes turn me off, because they really do look like something out of Salvation Army. I always wonder about that. I will explain a little bit - I come from a pretty poor background - nothing to get dramatic about, but poor enough - and I've always wondered why these trust fund baby hipsters always try to look poor, as if they are ashamed of something. Articles like this one in the NYT about rich people in their posh 5th Avenue apartment living on vegetables and not buying toilet paper, because they are so fucking New Age seem irresponsibly narcisisstic and indulgent to me - I mean, what's a poor starving person supposed to feel like if he were to read about these rich people playing at being poor?

                            Fashion is a form of ugliness so intolerable that we have to alter it every six months - Oscar Wilde

                            StyleZeitgeist Magazine

                            Comment

                            • JaridRose
                              Member
                              • Jan 2007
                              • 50

                              #15
                              Re: FORME 3'3204322896 F O R M D ' E X P R E S S I O N



                              I used to never wear blazers because I'm 25 years old, I too come from a "poor" background, family, etc...and never was in that whole "wear a blazer" group. I mean, today, if you walked out on the streets in L.A. and other cities too, you would see people my age wearing blazers, D&G, Dior, Juicy Couture, etc...and I said to a friend, "Do you wear blazers?" He replied, "No, I don't want to look like an asshole." Meaning, that These Kids and Their Blazers made them look like these rich kid assholes that never did anything in their life.....I never really saw too many kids wearing a deconstructed type blazer or clothes for that matter.....A "plain" blazer with maybe a silkscreened shirt and some true religion or seven jeans.....and some nikes...lol..................So that is why I prefer a blazer that is "not as asshole". If the rich kids start buying the "other kind" of blazer, so be it......but that is why, us poor kids who love fashion and don't want to look like your common Laguana Beach who travels to L.A. to party dude, need blazers and clothes that "they won't get yet".....theres much more to it but you know....and alot of rich kids want to put on that front that they are tough and not as rich etc. andwant that Deconstructed or whatever lookfor whatever reason....They get their info from Maxim magazine, so when Maxim says Deconstruction is in they run to Morphine Generation because dumbass maxim has said that that's what deconstruction and cool is. When well, you know, its not!




                              If the rich kids start to pick up on our style than we must always find something more........




                              There really is something that draws me to homeless people and they way the dress....that sounds cliche but its true....I had a friend who wore the 5 for $10 hollywood souvenir shirts with crusty old jeans and a beat up leather jacket, too small for him and flannels and blankets and crazy shoes....I read an interview with Rick Owens and he said something about these street people in L.A., and how he drew influence from them....But they can pull of an old YSL too, they know how to mix it up and do everything.....




                              People like D&G or GUCCI for that matter make good clothes but they Aim it at people with money, but MAN how great it looks on someone who doesnt have alot, maybe mixed with some old sweatpants and gloves to keep warm..........




                              Let me tell you, the rich kids LOVE "poor kid ideas", believe me.....that's why this whole NYT article and world is just that........When I was around other creative people with money, they knew that what I said about fashion was different TO THEM, and a truth they only saw...and they loved it, because people like Rick and ME (lol) and others, lived it, even for a moment, and he brought things his way, and others.....but people like Tom Ford only saw it and chose not to do it and maybe he did put a little poor in there...But for these others like Forme and CDiem and CDG...Margiela, Anne, etc...it all goes back to what you said, are we trying to make rich clothes look poor for WHATEVER reason.....and i think its, yes, it will all turn into that in a way, because our generation is embracing the ideas of the Poor because they hear in their college art class that Basquiat was a bum and made masterpieces so now they think--Hey, lets do this whole bum thing, lets listen to that poor kid who thinks he knows about fashion....stereotypes for both rich and poor etc...whatever....




                              Do i get offended? No, but it goes back to wondering, What are these peoples motivation, who are these people, etc? I care who is making this and where and all that crap....it does matter. I dont want my rockstars wearing a cowboy get up and I dont want my designers to be something that they are not....




                              So we're all going to be in trouble when the people we always loved like CDG start making shit for $$$ and the people we hate like Forme? start making stuff that we used to love...someone has to keep it "raw" forever or we have to start dressing completely different or something...i dont know. but its getting bad.

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