Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

[DHC]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

[quote user="philip nod"]

i've had my Ma+ calfskin wallet for at least a year and its doing great. it looks better once the cross etches into the leather from use. are you serious? a carrying bag to put your wallet in...? la la land being doing things to your brain

[/quote]

lulz

[Trendy Andy]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



[86] No seriously, it barely fits into my DRKSHDW jeans pocket, and it bulges on the side like as if I stuffed a breakfast burrito in there. I also noticed when I try sitting down, its just does things to the wallet I wish it would never do. [70]

[quote user="philip nod"]
i've had my Ma+ calfskin wallet for at least a year and its doing great. it looks better once the cross etches into the leather from use. are you serious? a carrying bag to put your wallet in...? la la land being doing things to your brain
[/quote]

[ddohnggo]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



i take out my wallet whenever i sit down. it feels like sitting on the george costanza wallet

[DHC]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

Andy, were you the one that bought Joey's wallet?

[Fuuma]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

I honestly don't understand the difference between those two items. I'm not trying to derail the thread or anything but aren't they both taking utilitarian items and giving them a new spins? Margiela is even referencing a commonly used type of shoe in some ethnicity while MA+ made a differently designed wallet. Are you trying to distinguish between garments that are "art pieces" and others that are a beautiful exemple of design giving an utilitarian item a different shape and properties?

[DHC]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



aesthetic vs. construction perhaps..

I don't see Margiela's shoe as a direct reference to a common ethnic shoe in the final product. I see reference to a 4 legged beast. Hoof on a human foot. Conveys a message to me. Though I suppose that message may be subjective.

I don't see the ma+ wallet as having been given new properties or shape. I see a tri-fold wallet with a different approach to construction.

[casem]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



Good topic DHC. It's difficult because, as others have said, we often look for both. As far as separating them, I would say on the runway, the artistic expression is what will immediately draw me in. The general image, mood and personalities of the characters being presented on the runway will lead me to follow a designer and check out their clothes in stores. But when I'm buying something, I don't want to be suckered by buying into the artistic expression too much and paying designer prices for something basic that has simply been ornamented. This has led me to look more at construction lately, because a unique construction of a garment is something truly special that can not be had at a lower price point (unlike say a t-shirt with a print on it). In fact, I have made a resolution not to buy any more clothes with a straightforward design because I have enough designer basics in my closet. This has led me to explore Ann and some of the Japanese brands more (sorry, still not into CCP).

Forgive me for delving into stereotypes, but something I have always noticed about this board is the emphasis on construction of a garment. This strikes me as a distinctly straight male point of view. I think it's great that so many straight guys can talk so in depth about fashion and not feel the least bit self conscious and this might explain it. Maybe I'm wrong, but the CCP thread is the ultimate example of guys talking about building stuff as if you were talking what goes into the engine of a car or lawn mower. Whereas, stereotypically female fashion interest (sorry Laika and Kira, you're far from typical I'm not talking about you) is more concerned with trends/looks/celebrity. I just can't see the girls from Sex in the City sitting around talking about the stitching of their dresses and how it's made from a single piece of object dyed fabric.

Anyway, sorry about my sociological musings, I don't mean to offend and I know I'm talking about sweeping generalization here, but it's something I'v always thought about and found it relevant here.

[kira]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

[quote user="casem83"]

Good topic DHC. It's difficult because, as others have said, we often look for both. As far as separating them, I would say on the runway, the artistic expression is what will immediately draw me in. The general image, mood and personalities of the characters being presented on the runway will lead me to follow a designer and check out their clothes in stores. But when I'm buying something, I don't want to be suckered by buying into the artistic expression too much and paying designer prices for something basic that has simply been ornamented. This has led me to look more at construction lately, because a unique construction of a garment is something truly special that can not be had at a lower price point (unlike say a t-shirt with a print on it). In fact, I have made a resolution not to buy any more clothes with a straightforward design because I have enough designer basics in my closet. This has led me to explore Ann and some of the Japanese brands more (sorry, still not into CCP).

Forgive me for delving into stereotypes, but something I have always noticed about this board is the emphasis on construction of a garment. This strikes me as a distinctly straight male point of view. I think it's great that so many straight guys can talk so in depth about fashion and not feel the least bit self conscious and this might explain it. Maybe I'm wrong, but the CCP thread is the ultimate example of guys talking about building stuff as if you were talking what goes into the engine of a car or lawn mower. Whereas, stereotypically female fashion interest (sorry Laika and Kira, you're far from typical I'm not talking about you) is more concerned with trends/looks/celebrity. I just can't see the girls from Sex in the City sitting around talking about the stitching of their dresses and how it's made from a single piece of object dyed fabric.

Anyway, sorry about my sociological musings, I don't mean to offend and I know I'm talking about sweeping generalization here, but it's something I'v always thought about and found it relevant here.

[/quote]

interesting indeed...i think very relevant and did not really think about things in that way.

interesting reference given today is the opening of the movie. [74]

[Johnny]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



casem - that is one of the best (and best expressed) observations I've seen on this forum! this is what I was trying to get at yonks ago about the "geekyness" of some of the threads here, but you made it much clearer. I think it's a really interesting observation.

[Faust]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

[quote user="Johnny"]

casem - that is one of the best (and best expressed) observations I've seen on this forum! this is what I was trying to get at yonks ago about the "geekyness" of some of the threads here, but you made it much clearer. I think it's a really interesting observation.

[/quote]

Haha, are you still reeling from droogist's comment?! that was harsh, i admit :-)

So, casem, I know you are looking forward to Sex and the City the film! [86]

[Johnny]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

i hesitate to ask this faust, but what was that comment again? i don't specifically remember it...[76]

[Faust]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering



[quote user="Johnny"]i hesitate to ask this faust, but what was that comment again? i don't specifically remember it...[76][/quote]

it was something about whether you think that all girls are shallow materialists and guys are simply collectors. something along those lines.

[Johnny]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

yes.... I think I agreed with that, at least the second bit, or did I propose it, fuck can't remember. anyway I do kind of agree with it, but the point about what casem said was that it included an explanation for it (the second bit anyway) - the need to deflect away from the"gayness" in having an interest in fashion by talking about it like it's like a model aeroplane.

[laika]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

^"materialist fetishists" were the women, i believe. As opposed to men who are geeky collector types.....[73]

[Johnny]

Re: Artistic Expression vs. Sartorial Engineering

ahah, it's coming flooding back. funnily enough i didn't feel that that was an attack because i don't think it's that perjorative a suggestion...i think as far as generalisations go it's not too bad