WTF

[Schadenfreude]

[fenrost]

btn.. lol!!

[lowrey]

ndf, regardless of how you intended it to come across, using a term that is commonly considered derogatory and highly offensive is obviously a bit risky, especially online where people who are not familiar with you or your ways.

I feel weird saying "lets get back" on topic as the last few pages have certainly been WTF-worthy, but lets change the subject anyways, please?

[Faust]

second. before i start internet-murdering people. ORDER, MOTHERFUCKERS!

[Fuuma]

dude Odyn vovk in itself is a bit of a wtf label- just like its japanese counterpart- Julius. I remember when julius was doing their super luxe satin lapeled suit jackets with their infamous cargo pants.

Back to the OV- Sorry austin im giving you 1 year before you jump ships from this 'dick oeven ninja' wagon and move on the next trend. 'SZ "ninja" style' is reaching mainstream appeal in australia( thanks to some trendy fags) and its nauseating.. like everytime i see a pair of combat boots worn with a drapey cardigan. i guess sz has moved on to the dark ages of povera goodness?

Please NDF. Julius have been doing their industrial look long and consistently enough not to be accused of biting or being derivative, you know better than that. I'm on record as thinking their first euro presentation was like a best of of their catalog and not as interesting for someone that already knew the label (goal=present it to Euro audiences) but the shows that followed it were killer, particularly the really hard-edged one w. the leather cargoes and red jacket. There's a reason why the brand is so popular in here; the make cool looking garments that we actually wear season after season. I can't quite grasp the "engrish" thing myself but Japanese culture perpetually perplexes me as I'm a hardcore western philosophy kind of guy and my encounters with anything Asian have been filled with WTF moments, many of them due to my own lack of understanding. I think it's good that we're critical of the brands discussed on SZ but let's keep in mind we're discussing stuff we, for the most part, actually like. If we want to let steam out maybe start a DSquared thread?

Sometimes it seems we like eating our young more than anything else.

[fenrost]

I am fairly certain that in FW09 Julius, they no longer have the corny engrish manifesto tag ... hopefully they will keep it that way.

[asho]

i think ndf's strong opinions may have stemmed from a conversation he and I revisit every now and then... which is basically that neither of us particularly likes the industrial aesthetic that julius has at its core... though, I think he may have forgotten that this opinion does not prevail around these parts.

...I will articulate my feelings at another time in another thread and hopefully have a proper discussion.

[Faust]

/\ fair enough, but that has nothing to do with equating Julius with O.V. Show me a label that Julius emulates.

[Fuuma]

i think ndf's strong opinions may have stemmed from a conversation he and I revisit every now and then... which is basically that neither of us particularly likes the industrial aesthetic that julius has at its core... though, I think he may have forgotten that this opinion does not prevail around these parts.

...I will articulate my feelings at another time in another thread and hopefully have a proper discussion.

Unless you think there is something inherently wrong or unauthentic in having an "industrial aesthetic", which is a possible discussion we could have, shouldn't you try to approach this style on it's own terms?

Keep in mind that I don't dress that way myself and still enjoy seeing it on other people. I'm sure some here hate the luxe/nightlife-casual look I affectionate but unless they develop why and bring interesting points regarding that who cares about their opinion.

[lotek01]

I remember when Julius first started getting attention there were plenty of detractors saying he ripped off Rick Owens (as any other black, dark, semi-drapey label would have been) but eventually it became accepted as its own beast, I think more in part to the dramatic draping they had more than the industrial/military side of it though, which seemed to become more prevalent later. It was always there but I'm sure for many (including me) it was the massive wearable curtains that got all the attention at that stage.

Also RE: the engrish, they probably stopped it after they started showing in Paris and realised that the rest of the world knows considerably more english than the Japanese do... it was probably as cool to them as some vague sanskrit writing on a shirt is to us.

[cabl3]

[asho]

/\ fair enough, but that has nothing to do with equating Julius with O.V. Show me a label that Julius emulates.

i would not equate the two. I was suggesting that ndf's post had more to do with an illogical rant than anything else.

[asho]

Unless you think there is something inherently wrong or unauthentic in having an "industrial aesthetic", which is a possible discussion we could have, shouldn't you try to approach this style on it's own terms?

Keep in mind that I don't dress that way myself and still enjoy seeing it on other people. I'm sure some here hate the luxe/nightlife-casual look I affectionate but unless they develop why and bring interesting points regarding that who cares about their opinion.

perhaps i need to start the "Im sorry but I don't like this" thread...
But for now I need to say something to avoid the stigma of your last sentence (a point i often make myself). I don't so much feel that there is a problem with the ideas julius' collections stem from, more their articulation- which to me is often over the top in the way that would leave others stamped 'instant fail'. For example the cargo pants that the seem to do quite often which are so over pocketed that they would make a GI jealous, especially in leather. I also wonder why it is that the leather jackets are the only items lusted after from previous seasons. I think it must be because they are the only thing which can be worn and not have you look like mad max, quilt coat excluded.

I know there are some nice pieces here and there, and some of these do appeal to me. It's just than in most cases these are not those which could be labelled distinctly julius. When this happens it leaves me doubting a designer's vision.

[ironman]

BLESS fur-ball sweater @ 1245 Euros



sidenote: i hate colette's website

[STEALTH]

I don't so much feel that there is a problem with the ideas julius' collections stem from, more their articulation- which to me is often over the top in the way that would leave others stamped 'instant fail'.

You mean "over the top" as in EXTREME ?!

As in not too much concerned about commercialism but more about following one's own vision in order to satisfy one's own artistic aspirations and vision ?!

i agree totally with you on this point.

There are a shed-load of new labels who are modifying Horikawa's raw , "not giving a fuck" approach and taking it right to the bank.
Including one pretty famous Brand that I had to quit in disgust when it got too appalling.

Maybe they should employ you to get them on the schedule in Milano along with all the other shallow commercial money machines that you obviously worship ?!

The truth is all the accusations and misinformation constantly repeated here mostly stems from ignorance of the truth. An ignorance born out of the fact that A) Julius was for the longest time an exclusively Asian Brand and B) They have intentionally kept themselves an "underground" phenonoma and purposefully mysterious and remote from the "fashion" world.

Part of the reason that they eventually emerged on the Parisian Runway was to clear away some of this ignorance , but obviously this is going to take some time.

I know each and every one of the doubts and accusations that have been leveled at this Label and I can better than most explain and repudiate each and every one.

The reason being that I KNOW the truth.

And Knowledge is Power.