Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

Fine, I'm a label whore! As long as they are good labels.[66]

[Real Real]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

Thanks Rach, Faust, they are both good points. People who are shopping for a specific designer (whether for good or bad reasons) will be inconvenienced by this kind of set-up.



Thinking through the counter-counter-argument...people have more and more options when it comes to shopping specific designers. There are more brand-specific designer stores opening up...Rick Owens in New York, Dolce & Gabbana menswear only store in NYC, etc. A lot of designers are seeing the advantages of selling clothes through a website, and so on, where they can deal directly with their customers.



There are more than enough channels for the person who knows exactly what they want, and as access continues to grow, I think it's going to be harder and harder for the big department stores to compete. Just reiterating - where it then seems like they could win is by presenting a vision of certain types of styles to their customer, providing their customer with some guidance, selling different types of lifestyle to their customers through the clothes...creating their own brands using the clothes of other people, the way Atelier does, or some individuals do. Barneys, Jeffreys, Bergdorf probably think that they do that right now - I'm sure they have an idea of "their customer" - but it's too broad, unless their customer is just some idiot who is fashion-obsessed and will take whatever they throw at him.



There's always room to mix approaches, also...some in-house ministores that combine a variety of brands, and for certain flagship brands, a ministore of their own.



How does a store like Barneys react when they find out that Rick Owens is opening up a store just downtown from them? It'll be interesting to see how Barneys sales of Owens will change now that they have that competition? Maybe all the publicity the store has received will benefit both RO and Barneys, although I can't see that lasting long-term.



Also, I wonder f the big designers demand that their clothing be displayed separately, if they'd stop selling to a store that tried this approach? I would think the stores would have the power to set the tone, but maybe not.

[rach2jlc]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.



[quote user="Faust"]Fine, I'm a label whore! As long as they are good labels.[66]
[/quote]

Of course I wasn't really thinking of YOU or ME, Faust. Yes, we're label whores, but of a different kind... What I was meaning were people who couldn't care less about the garment in question, ONLY the label or the price tag. For example, you and I like Yohji and Ann D, but if she had a crappy cotton tee, made in Turkey, with giant ANN D PARIS or something on the front with an interlocking AD monogram, priced at $250, you'd probably go, "Umm... no thanks!"

To give an idea of what I had in mind by "label whore," right now on SF there is a new member who said unabashedly that the ONLY criteria he uses to judge clothes it the label and that it has an expensive price tag. So, on the "best jeans" thread, where others post 45rpm and other superlative jeans, he posted some $800 Hermes jeans that he bought. When asked why he bought them... it was because they were Hermes and because they were $800. THAT'S the "Label Whorism" I had in mind to criticize!!! He then posted Gucci, LV, Prada, and HUGO BOSS (yes, Hugo Boss), telling all of us that we were plebians because we refused to worship his purchases as being superlatively wonderful in every degree.

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.



EDIT: @ REAL-REAL

I think one of the reasons for Barneys' success is that they do have a theme! Taste.Luxury.Humor! I think it works very well (besides or thanks to Sarah Jessica Horse's facile endorsements on HBO) in attracting a young stylish customer. They even make old people with money feel young - they can buy their Kiton in a fun environment and not in the deader-than-dead old clubhouse of Bergdorf that reminds me more and more of a high end nursing home. I think Barneys has captured the consumerist zeitgeist pretty well - don't take yourself seriously, live for today, and shop, shop, shop! And BECAUSE they attract the by-now-proverbial Sex and the City consumer, they automatically attract all the periphery denizens who watch the show and want to be like those girls. It's not cool to go to Saks - that's for soccer moms - it's cool to go to Barneys.

What Saks and Bergdorf have missed (well, Bergdorf may not care, being a part of Neuman - but they probably would care otherwise) was a cultural shift in the 80's-90's where young people have become richer and richer thanks to the explosion of the art market. They could afford expensive clothes, but they wanted something creative and interesting. The dot com boom and the online media explosion had also exacerbated this trend, making a lot of young people either rich or at least able to afford expensive clothes.

Retail industry is not the only one who suffers from big ego and lack of foresight. In the 70's when the computing industry started booming, the likes of Microsoft and Intel came to the American Stock Exchange because they weren't big enough for the New York Stock Exchange. The AMEX executives in their blind arrogance turned them away, and they all went to NASDAQ. Ooops.

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

[quote user="rach2jlc"]

[quote user="Faust"]Fine, I'm a label whore! As long as they are good labels.[66]
[/quote]

Of course I wasn't really thinking of YOU or ME, Faust. Yes, we're label whores, but of a different kind... What I was meaning were people who couldn't care less about the garment in question, ONLY the label or the price tag. For example, you and I like Yohji and Ann D, but if she had a crappy cotton tee, made in Turkey, with giant ANN D PARIS or something on the front with an interlocking AD monogram, priced at $250, you'd probably go, "Umm... no thanks!"

To give an idea of what I had in mind by "label whore," right now on SF there is a new member who said unabashedly that the ONLY criteria he uses to judge clothes it the label and that it has an expensive price tag. So, on the "best jeans" thread, where others post 45rpm and other superlative jeans, he posted some $800 Hermes jeans that he bought. When asked why he bought them... it was because they were Hermes and because they were $800. THAT'S the "Label Whorism" I had in mind to criticize!!! He then posted Gucci, LV, Prada, and HUGO BOSS (yes, Hugo Boss), telling all of us that we were plebians because we refused to worship his purchases as being superlatively wonderful in every degree.

[/quote]

I know, I know - I was just teasing. Wow, that guy sounds like a total tool - worship Hugo Boss, now!

[rach2jlc]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.



Yeah, with those sorts of clueless posters (and on ANY forum they'll come around from time to time) I usually try to take the high road, be mature, and just let it be... but in this case, I'm ashamed to admit that I've been antagonizing him a little bit. I couldn't resist...

Anyway, yes, I think we need to start a subforum dedicated ONLY to the glories of Hugo Boss. I'll start...

umm...merits.... ummm... okay... the cloth doesn't burst into flames when coming into contact with sunlight? I guess that's a merit. Beyond that, I can't think of anything.

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

[quote user="rach2jlc"]

Yeah, with those sorts of clueless posters (and on ANY forum they'll come around from time to time) I usually try to take the high road, be mature, and just let it be... but in this case, I'm ashamed to admit that I've been antagonizing him a little bit. I couldn't resist...

Anyway, yes, I think we need to start a subforum dedicated ONLY to the glories of Hugo Boss. I'll start...

umm...merits.... ummm... okay... the cloth doesn't burst into flames when coming into contact with sunlight? I guess that's a merit. Beyond that, I can't think of anything.

[/quote]

Link to the said discussion?! [<:o)]

[rach2jlc]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.



Here are a few gems:

http://www.styleforum.net/showthread.php?t=7852

http://www.styleforum.net/showthread.php?t=75317

You'll see the poster in question quite quickly (he's in the subject line of the second link) and if you click on "view other posts" you'll see what we're talking about... ;)

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.



hahahahahaha

"I have 35 pairs of shoes none less than the most acclaimed brands like
Prada, gucci, CD, Porsche design, Hugoboss, dolce & gabbana (not
d&g) Hermes and LV's and etc. These all have won their accolades in
Leather goods and foot wear."

Especially like how he expertly pointed out the difference between DG and D&G.

[rach2jlc]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

[quote user="Faust"]

Especially like how he expertly pointed out the difference between DG and D&G.

[/quote]

Would you have expected any less? We're not talking Ittierre made goods here, my friend. :)

[Faust]

Re: Saks profits fall again - still don't want to hire Faust as head menswear buyer.

Speaking of which, I have to resurrect the who makes what for whom thread.

[reborn]

Just another pov

New to SZ...I read through the threads and just wanted to add: for the most part, department store buyers are not buying for a local customer...but for in the case of national chains, an "average" consumer that fits their typical profile.

Saks, Neimans, even Barneys has an inventory that is tailored to appeal to a wide audience. And as such, the interesting and unique perspectives of a designers work are totally lost. It's really sad.

If you have ever been the Bloomingdales in SoHo, you can always here tourists, myself included, commenting on the selections, which are not typical bloomingdales: gianni barbato, cdg, junya watanabe, victor & rolf, cp company, etc.

Equally, for small boutiques, the buyers typically are talking to the frequent shop customers and/or they are working on curating a selection for the store that has direction, interest and style.

just some thoughts.

[Fade to Black]

hahahahahaha

"I have 35 pairs of shoes none less than the most acclaimed brands like
Prada, gucci, CD, Porsche design, Hugoboss, dolce & gabbana (not
d&g) Hermes and LV's and etc. These all have won their accolades in
Leather goods and foot wear."

Especially like how he expertly pointed out the difference between DG and D&G.

that guy is ridiculous, he can't be real.

Hugo Boss? I didn't know people still wore that crap. I have a pair of lace ups from Boss Selection i wear as business wear sometimes, but I don't quite like acknowledging what the brand is when asked.

[rach2jlc]

^I, too, have a few HB things... some of them are quite decent, but as you said, I'm always embarrassed to acknowledge it.

In my admittedly biased opinion, Boss is one of those brands-of-choice for guys who think the earth revolves around them because they have BOSS, not knowing any better (and having never heard of ANY of the brands we talk about here, or any of the better sartorial makers like Borrelli or Isaia). Oh yeah, and their other suit is ARMANI! Worship the ground they walk upon!!! And their shoes are Donald J. Pliner or Magli... pow!

As such, even though SOME of the stuff they make isn't bad, it makes me feel guilty-by-association.

[Faust]

Yep, Boss and Armani = douchebagwear.