Boris Bidjan Saberi - Mens - SS12 - Paris

[Patroklus]

This is why I don't think fashion can be an art,

Anything can be artistic, including stacking rocks and pissing your name in the snow.

when someone like Rick makes a strong visual statement, there are immediately questions of is it wearable? can I buy it and put it to use? etc.

Functionality doesn't necessarily have anything to do with artistry.

[casem]

Yes, it can be artistic but I'm not sure it can be art if it must constantly be weighed against utility.

[Patroklus]

It doesn't. That's the sort of falsity I really only expect from people who need reasons not to like fashion.

[christianef]

Sometimes i do wonder where you get your ideas from.
BBS showed his first collection under his own name in Barcelona on a Runway in 07 believe(if i remember correctly he started a small label after graduating or whilst still @ uni). The same season that Damir showed his first SS collection.
So i don't know how on earth you got the idea that he started the label to capitalise on growing/popular aesthetic.
BBS has stayed very true and similar throughout, whilst if you compare DD's first collection, to what he is doing now, in such a short time has changed quite alot (granted the same shapes and pieces pop up even in the latest collections, just a tad slimmer and in more "luxe" fabrics.

As for your last sentence...... maybe you should invest in a few pieces yourself in this case.....

ya i said 'it seems' like...ie. there were dozens of rappers who rapped somewhat similar to Eminem during the epoch of Eminem and then when Eminem broke out were subsequently acknowledged and even embraced by the existing niche because they fit the now established demographic that he essentially created and everyone was in love with despite in most cases still not really offering anything of substance just a mere semblance to that which arguably did. happens with every subculture and usually marks some type of demise case in point BBS. granted thats just how i see it - though no matter how you slice the galaktoboureko it tastes pretty awful.

[SHYE_POSER]

WOW! We are using Eminem as an example? Even in that you have no idea what you are saying. By the time eminem "broke" out, hip hop was no longer a small niche, first of all. Secondly, the only thing Em brought to the table, apart from flow and lyrical content was the fact that he was white. No one bit his style etc etc etc. And the was'nt a huge surge in White rappers either.
So that point again seems void.

BBS and DD showed their first collections both at the same time. Buyers where excited by both, at the same time. Neither came before the other.
So again your point seems wholly un valid.

Your sweeping comments "aimed towards people who dont really know what they are talking about and they identify with this because it too is for the most part aimless".

Such as that above are ridiculous. What you are saying is that all those who like BBS's work have no idea what they are talking about and are aimless.

If you are gonna use metaphors, please do it properly.
How do you cut a galatoboureko? You don't, its like the Greek economy one little touch and it starts to crumble.
It is an acquired taste, almost like yourself it seems.

[Pumpfish]

It's easy to over intellectualise Boris.

He makes jackets that make your shoulders look bigger, and separates that make your body look longer.

He makes you look tougher.

[Oh weh mir]

^fuck yes, when my tiny 110lb frame is draped in an oversized cross back sleeveless top I feel so fucking hardcore machismo I pick fights at dive bars with the bouncer's girlfriend just to stir shit up.

I agree that boris is not the best designer to intellectualize. He seems to have a lot of largely unrelated interests and although I can see some influence on his collections, I don't think there's meant to be a lot of philosophy or message in his work. Seems like Boris is Boris's theme more than anything, and that's enough for me when considering an eponymous label I'd say it's sort of paramount.

[several_girls]

ya i said 'it seems' like...ie. there were dozens of rappers who rapped somewhat similar to Eminem during the epoch of Eminem and then when Eminem broke out were subsequently acknowledged and even embraced by the existing niche because they fit the now established demographic that he essentially created and everyone was in love with despite in most cases still not really offering anything of substance just a mere semblance to that which arguably did. happens with every subculture and usually marks some type of demise case in point BBS. granted thats just how i see it - though no matter how you slice the galaktoboureko it tastes pretty awful.

Looking at BBS in person, I wouldn't say he has come in on any sort of tidal wave of market interest, i'm not even sure such a thing exists. No doubt that RO's clientele is growing, but let's not make mountains out of molehills. This entire enterprise (male fashion) is still incredibly niche and relatively insulated from the fashion industry at large. The fashion industry itself is small-time compared to agriculture, currency speculation, chemicals or software. Bearing all this in mind, it's difficult to imagine BBS (or any male fashion designer) as an opportunist.

The clothes are crafts achievements, in both their construction and finishing. They're garments unto themselves, so to speak. He can't possibly ape RO, RO doesn't work with the production process the same way BBS does. RO has an interest in textile, but only insofar as it elevates his clothes to bridge that gap he perceived between couture and streetwear. Hence the viscose/silk tank tops where one would normally use 100% cotton. With a few exceptions, RO doesn't punish his clothes the way BBS does.

BBS is also distinguished from Damir: Damir selects a textile he finds compelling and develops a garment to suit the textile. BBS' preoccupation is in finishing the garment this way or that way. He's a bit of a scientist, he experiments with different treatments.

I think you group together all the "avant-garde" designers in your head in one space (Julius, Damir, RO, Odyn Vovk et al), but if you did some research it would reveal the immense and subtle differences between them. Think about how this thing came to hang on the rack. The process from earth's soil to your hand is very different from one designer to another.

There is also the complication with the runway. Some (like Thom Browne, John Galliano or *gulp* DSquared) love the pageantry, embrace it fully and do all they can with it. For designers like BBS or Odyn Vovk, the runway doesn't really suit the nature of their work. They aren't showmen and their clothes don't belong in a spectacle. The runway also piles on all the clothes of a single season onto one person. This for some designers preserves a unity of their vision, but consider the possibility that other designers don't seek an entire wardrobe at once, and do so out of logical necessity than inspiration.

[lowrey]

[Peasant]

Great post, s.girls. It's astonishing that this argument comes up every time he puts out a collection. Same people saying the same shit. In the beginning.. yes. I agreed with some of the comparisons. Now, after multiple collections, unique cuts and truly individual garments it's really gotten old, unnecessary and unwarranted. Seriously.. a Rick / Boris copy argument? Please.

[Fuuma]

It's nice to draw distinctions but on the other hand can we agree there is a definite DNA between various designers liked on SZ and sold in the same shops? Some of it is due to the all dark, all the time overwhelmingly popular aesthetic that Atelier brought to the fore and SZ keeps putting forward put some of it also resides within the output of the designers themselves.

[DRRRK]

The last posts here were all great. And the all-knowing Fuuma nails it (nice to have met you at Adeline's place). Although the last collection is still a little boring, i blame the runway and colours for this and can't wait to see the clothes at Darklands. The FW 11/12 show was far from being boring though with the skaters and the models walking on different levels. Skaters and music embraced his subcultural influences perfectly. The SS 11 show did not look boring either, at least not on video.
After I bought my first BBS piece, the FW 10 coat in that one pic, some friends who knew nothing about BBS before could see that the stuff I bought later is from the same source, not only because of the strap. So it has to be either me, or the clothes itself that have their own language. As nobody thought my DD, VA or Julius was Boris, it has to be the clothes.

[christianef]

WOW! We are using Eminem as an example? Even in that you have no idea what you are saying. By the time eminem "broke" out, hip hop was no longer a small niche, first of all. Secondly, the only thing Em brought to the table, apart from flow and lyrical content was the fact that he was white. No one bit his style etc etc etc. And the was'nt a huge surge in White rappers either.
So that point again seems void.

BBS and DD showed their first collections both at the same time. Buyers where excited by both, at the same time. Neither came before the other.
So again your point seems wholly un valid.

Your sweeping comments "aimed towards people who dont really know what they are talking about and they identify with this because it too is for the most part aimless".

Such as that above are ridiculous. What you are saying is that all those who like BBS's work have no idea what they are talking about and are aimless.

If you are gonna use metaphors, please do it properly.
How do you cut a galatoboureko? You don't, its like the Greek economy one little touch and it starts to crumble.
It is an acquired taste, almost like yourself it seems.

actually a pretty huge surge of white punch line rappers did succeed Eminem that wouldnt have been given the time of day other wise. could have used any sub genre - brit pop, dubb step, emo-core, nu-rave, teen pregnancy, the sounds, rollerblading, models with gap teeth, the bands, bush - i think we all can agree there's always posers who gain recognition because they fit into the scene and there are lots of aimless scenesters just look the waywt they pop up all the time. thats just how i view BBS im not even saying he intentionally does this thats just how his line comes across for me, yanni.

[Fuuma]

Boris tattoos, might (not) be relevant:

http://sangbleu.com/2010/11/20/boris-tattoos/

[AKA*NYC]

nice font