Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08 - Paris

[Real Real]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

Went to Saks and the Soho Yoji store to check some of the F/W Yohii stuff out. First off, the prices on everything are ridiculous. If the materials felt luxurious, the prices might have felt a little less insane - but so much of the material he uses doesn't feel that good. Heavy knit $1700 100% wool cardigans that feel like a wool sweater you could find anywhere. The jacket/overcoat wool that he uses feels like the kind of stuff you'd find on a Jos A Bank suit.



With that said, so much of it was so awesome. The coats that unzip to show plaid underneath are f'ing great, so weird, and so cool. There were a lot of the tweed-y looking pieces at the Soho Yohji store, and the construction was great, what looks like hand-stitching on almost anything. There was a Y's silk shirt screen-printed with a lot of 50s-dubya-dubya-two girls with their tits out that I wanted badly for some unknown reason. Weird, cool tie-dye t-shirts and turtlenecks (for $800+!).



Above all, there were a pair of black oxfords with one line of creeper-style woven leather bisecting the shoe lengthwise that were cool as hell. I may need to go back for them. I've had a mediocre experience with the one pair of YY boots I have (kind of uncomfortable), so I don't know if I want to shell out.

[Faust]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



Saks Yohji buy > Barneys Yohji buy. WTF? [79]

Interesting that you say that about the fabrics, I'll pay close attention when I go look again.

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

while i think Yohji's use of fabrics is good, it's definitely not high on the luxe scale. But it's not nearly as rough or coarse as say, Watanabe either. Kinda in the middle...but it works for the pieces he makes.

[mesh]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



[quote user="Real Real"]Went to Saks and the Soho Yoji store to check some of the F/W Yohii stuff out. First off, the prices on everything are ridiculous. If the materials felt luxurious, the prices might have felt a little less insane - but so much of the material he uses doesn't feel that good. Heavy knit $1700 100% wool cardigans that feel like a wool sweater you could find anywhere. The jacket/overcoat wool that he uses feels like the kind of stuff you'd find on a Jos A Bank suit.

With that said, so much of it was so awesome. The coats that unzip to show plaid underneath are f'ing great, so weird, and so cool. There were a lot of the tweed-y looking pieces at the Soho Yohji store, and the construction was great, what looks like hand-stitching on almost anything. There was a Y's silk shirt screen-printed with a lot of 50s-dubya-dubya-two girls with their tits out that I wanted badly for some unknown reason. Weird, cool tie-dye t-shirts and turtlenecks (for $800+!).

Above all, there were a pair of black oxfords with one line of creeper-style woven leather bisecting the shoe lengthwise that were cool as hell. I may need to go back for them. I've had a mediocre experience with the one pair of YY boots I have (kind of uncomfortable), so I don't know if I want to shell out.[/quote]

I thought the exact same thing when I felt this piece at barneys. Should be more like 800.

[Faust]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

[quote user="mesh"]

[quote user="Real Real"]Went to Saks and the Soho Yoji store to check some of the F/W Yohii stuff out. First off, the prices on everything are ridiculous. If the materials felt luxurious, the prices might have felt a little less insane - but so much of the material he uses doesn't feel that good. Heavy knit $1700 100% wool cardigans that feel like a wool sweater you could find anywhere. The jacket/overcoat wool that he uses feels like the kind of stuff you'd find on a Jos A Bank suit.

With that said, so much of it was so awesome. The coats that unzip to show plaid underneath are f'ing great, so weird, and so cool. There were a lot of the tweed-y looking pieces at the Soho Yohji store, and the construction was great, what looks like hand-stitching on almost anything. There was a Y's silk shirt screen-printed with a lot of 50s-dubya-dubya-two girls with their tits out that I wanted badly for some unknown reason. Weird, cool tie-dye t-shirts and turtlenecks (for $800+!).

Above all, there were a pair of black oxfords with one line of creeper-style woven leather bisecting the shoe lengthwise that were cool as hell. I may need to go back for them. I've had a mediocre experience with the one pair of YY boots I have (kind of uncomfortable), so I don't know if I want to shell out.[/quote]

I thought the exact same thing when I felt this piece at barneys. Should be more like 800.

[/quote]

These days it's $800 in gas to haul it from Japan.

[mesh]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

I guess so man, I saw it on the table and though oh this is alright. Touched it and didn't feel like anything special neither was the knit and then I was blown away by the $1800 price tag. Seriously who buys this?

[Real Real]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

I don't know. I like nice, heavy black knits, and I a couple of years ago I bought a sweater for maybe $800, marked down from $1200, that is near identical to that Yohji one. The one difference is that my sweater is 100% heavy knit cashmere, not cheap feeling wool.



I don't get it. Is it a reverse snobbery thing? The fact that the materials are consciously cheap feeling helps assuage some of the guilt for paying such ridiculous prices for clothing?

[Faust]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

It's all about charging what the market can bear. If there are Yohji fans with a boatload of money, then hey, why not. BUT, given what I saw at Barneys this season I am beginning to think that the middle class consumer does have a fairly big role in designer clothing market, and that consumer is wiped out by now. It's an interesting topic, and noone wants to do the fucking research!

[AKA*NYC]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



[quote user="Faust"]BUT, given what I saw at Barneys this season I am beginning to think that the middle class consumer does have a fairly big role in designer clothing market
[/quote]

Do you mean that Barneys counts on the middle class customer to purchase designer clothes? Or that the designer has the middle class customer in mind?

[Faust]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

[quote user="AKA*NYC"]

[quote user="Faust"]BUT, given what I saw at Barneys this season I am beginning to think that the middle class consumer does have a fairly big role in designer clothing market
[/quote]

Do you mean that Barneys counts on the middle class customer to purchase designer clothes? Or that the designer has the middle class customer in mind?

[/quote]

I think the entire industry relies on it. The mass luxury phenomenon has fueled the growth in designer goods, and now that consumer is getting hit hard, and the market has to shrink. I've never seen Barneys mark down so aggressively so quickly and a ton of shit left over - same for Saks. It looks like an Atelier type store which has locked in a moneyed niche and is small enough to rely on it is a better business these days. I also think that the designers will feel the pain too - Barneys can survive on sunglasses and perfume - it's the designers that sell actual clothes I fear for.

[Chinorlz]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



[quote user="mesh"]I guess so man, I saw it on the table and though oh this is alright. Touched it and didn't feel like anything special neither was the knit and then I was blown away by the $1800 price tag. Seriously who buys this?[/quote]

holy shit. $1800 for a knit? That surpasses CCP level pricing [:|] yet Yohji still says his designs are for the everyman? It can't be both ways. Not everyone has the time or ability to dig on ebay/SZ hehehe

[Avantster]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



I think the story is a little different in Japan. Every time I've visited the Aoyama flagship most, if not all, of the key pieces of the season are sold out within days of hitting the floor. Most of his local customers are older too, and are in a stage of their life where they can afford those prices.

In my experience the markup for YY overseas is anywhere from twenty to a whopping fifty percent! Is it justifiable? I'd really like to know.

YY is focused more on cut and tailoring, rather than fabric. He was never about using luxurious fabrics.

I totally agree that $2K for an ordinary knit is ridiculous. But people do buy it, and for them the price is probably irrelevant.

[quote user="Faust"]I think the entire industry relies on it. The mass
luxury phenomenon has fueled the growth in designer goods, and now that
consumer is getting hit hard, and the market has to shrink. I've never
seen Barneys mark down so aggressively so quickly and a ton of shit
left over - same for Saks. It looks like an Atelier type store which
has locked in a moneyed niche and is small enough to rely on it is a
better business these days. I also think that the designers will feel
the pain too - Barneys can survive on sunglasses and perfume - it's the
designers that sell actual clothes I fear for. [/quote]

Agreed. It's not a great time to be an independent designer right now.

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



Yohji's treatment of fabrics is definitely well thought out and meticulous, but like i said it was never meant to be as luxe as a Lanvin. But saying that, i think he gets knocked around for this in the thread more than say, Junya Watanabe, whose fabrics are basically peasant-status yet prices undoubtedly much higher than Yohji ($2500 for a Brooks Brothers navy blazer with trimming? Get outta here).

And like Avantster said, the YY stuff in the mothership is 50% less of what it retails for elsewhere. So in that context it makes more sense.

yohji is nowhere near as ridiculous with prices as CCP.

[Honey~Blade]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris

I have to agree with Matt on Junya Men's pricing. The fabric is ridiculously crappy for the prices charged!

[the breaks]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto Mens FW08-09 - Paris



[quote user="matthewhk"]

yohji is nowhere near as ridiculous with prices as CCP.
[/quote]

I find myself very disappointed with the "bang for your buck" of Yohji's pieces. At least with Poell I know I'm getting something a little special for my money. Both are priced ridiculously, but with Poell you feel the justification is (kind of) there.