Carol Christian Poell

[awlouie]

this is seriously nuts - sound like you guys think poell invented the lace up shoe and any iteration is a copy.....go into any shoe shop and there will be 100's of derbies all the same but with slightly different features.....poell is going to be one busy man sueing all these manufacturers....clarks shoes must be seriously worried.........if you like poell, buy poell, if you like augusta, by augusta....and if you like both, buy both - whats the big issue????

......and converse by the way are surely going to sue poell or does a different tongue and some rubber that wears off count as different enough not to be a copy???????????????????.....

I'd agree...In the fashion as well as other industries, everyone borrows from each other. If you asked Poell he'd probably tell you that he got his inspiration from someone, something, or somewhere.

[bestial]

You need to get inspired to be able to create.

And not only in the fashion industry, music, movies, art. Tarantino almost gets more credit for his sources of inspiration then his movies. Nirvana breaked with a Pixies rip-off.

[the breaks]

^seriously? This has long been discussed when Augusta first started to gain popularity on here.. His boots were season after season nearly identical to carols classic goodyear last derbies and boots.. There was talk of Carol refusing to have his work in the same store as Simones.. A.. etc.. and did Lift refuse to carry him at first or is this all made up in my mind?

Oh I thought you might have some more recent info or something

[fenrost]

this is seriously nuts.

I think, the issue here is that, it's not about the sneakers. it's about his work has resemblance to poell several times. When augusta recently did an interview at hlorenzo, he mention along transparenting a leather:

"I will tell you of the transparent leather for this season. The transparent leather is a pig leather...I developed only 7 pairs of shoes for women in the world. Also the sole is transparent and the heel is transparent. "

now poell had this take of transparenting leather as well long time ago. (sorry can't find pics of shoes).

I am not saying poell himself is all original (but i think we are safe to say he is crazy enough to experiment?). now let just say, when you are a designer and you work hard on what you do, someone come along and got "inspired" and reproduce what you do, all the time. For me, it can be quite uncomfortable, furthermore it's a small niche market we are talking here. Just think about it.

[Faust]

^seriously? This has long been discussed when Augusta first started to gain popularity on here.. His boots were season after season nearly identical to carols classic goodyear last derbies and boots.. There was talk of Carol refusing to have his work in the same store as Simones.. A.. etc.. and did Lift refuse to carry him at first or is this all made up in my mind?

correct on all accounts.

[Johnny]

good post eternal. looks to me like ccp copied those shoes exactly, but simply used different material. doesn't that sort of thing make it difficult for him to throw hissy fits about others "copying" him? object dyed blinkers indeed.

[Venus in Furs]

All art is semi-recycled, there is no point in arguing for absolute originality. I'm my opinion, it's all about interpretation, how you interpret things which have come before and make them your own. For this reason, I think Carol's drip rubber sneakers are the greatest interpretation of the all stars. While the converse influence is obvious, Carol's own voice is heard. The sneaker amazes me more every time I see it, it just says so much, there's something very eerie about them, and they say a lot about Carol's philosophy/ideas with regard to leather/construction/mobility/deterioration etc.

For me, when looking for a garment it's all about who interprets it the best. But when I look at Augusta, it doesn't look like Simone's interpreting anything. How identical that pair of Carol sneakers are to Augusta's is somewhat extraneous, it's the fact that on numerous occassions there's been more than obvious similarities with Carol's work.

[Faust]

Exactly, Venus. People, don't conflate inspiration with direct copying.

[fenrost]

when looking for a garment it's all about who interprets it the best. But when I look at Augusta, it doesn't look like Simone's interpreting anything.

Ditto. : \

In the end, there are people who care, and there are people who don't - they buy simply because they like it, no other particular reason. Same thing as some people on poell.

But I care, at least I would like to think that every single cent i have spent, are fundings to their artistic (if they have any) endeavour.

[philip nod]

it's simple really. carol has created a world where everything in it is unmistakeably carol. Augusta has created a world where everything in it is also unmistakeably carol, or more so than it is his own.
it's a question of artistic creation and the ownership of a world and the language within that world that has been created. not a cloak and dagger sleuthing of where and what people are lifting from.
the beastie boys comes to mind
"only twelve notes that a man can play"

[Faust]

/\ well put.

[kukuberger]

somehow a quote unquote designer knocking off another designer seems far more egregious than a fast fashion retailer doing it. More shameful I guess. At Augusta prices, he isn't making it affordable to the masses, he's lacking inspiration.

[nellytheelephant]

somehow a quote unquote designer knocking off another designer seems far more egregious than a fast fashion retailer doing it. More shameful I guess. At Augusta prices, he isn't making it affordable to the masses, he's lacking inspiration.

It's an interesting logic and why after a bit of initial indignation I'm not bothered by the Harnden and RO knock-offs in All Saints.

[Castor]

All Saints is even knocking off Ann. I'd never been in before and we stopped by and I was floored.

[Nostromo]

The never-ending Augusta vs Poell discussion^^.
I mean there are some Augusta pieces where you can't say if it's actually Augusta or CCP, but sometimes it sounds like Augusta is doing nothing else but copying Poell which is not right in my opinion. I still think that a lot, if not most, Augusta shoes are pretty original in their design.
Regardless of that, I guess it's not really fair to compare Cechetto with Poell. Judging from the interview with H.Lorenzo (if I remember right) he doesn't seem like someone with an elaborated philosophy behind his work, and also he doesn't seem to claim anything else. He's rather like an artisan who really loves to create shoes.