The cinema thread

[Fuuma]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread



[quote user=&quot;mass&quot;]i really love bresson... i love mouchette, although to be honest it took me a few tries before i could get through all of diary of a country priest in one sitting... i watched the departed last week... kind of dissapointed because i thought it started off extremely well. nobody agrees with me that harvey keitel would&#39;ve played the part better than jack nicholson, either. looking forward to borat soon...[/quote]</p>

<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial">I think the two adaptation of Bernanos novels I saw (diary of a country priest-Bresson and Under the sun ofSatan-Pialat)were pretty amazing in the depth with which they explored the meaning of faith, especially how their Christ-like characters were unsuited (too pure?)to daily life as members of small, rural communities. It&#39;s interesting to note that Pialat was definitely a non-believer, contrary to Bresson, which didn&#39;t stop him from making a deeply mystical film. He, of course, mixed it with his usual brand of conflicted characters all fragility and defiance clashing against each others in extreme contexts (death, love, suicide, etc.) but stayed away from his typical naturalism for amore literary style that made me think, in a way, of Bresson&#39;s direction (with emotion addedin the mix...).</span></p>

<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial">I saw the Departed and actually enjoyed the movie. The story is pretty much the same as Infernal Affairs but the treatment is what makes it different, IA is a sleek, modern, tightly editedthriller all steely blues and greys set in the &quot;high rise jungle&quot; not a well made cop/gangster drama with interesting characterizations, a 70s editing style (no MTV for you!!) and a good depiction of Boston slums and urban decay. DiCaprio is certainly not a great actor and almost unbelievable as any form of tough guy but I guess Scorsese&#39;s talent made me forget that a little. As for Damon he can only play a clean-cut, up and coming preppy young man and thankfully that&#39;s what the role entailed, which means his small range didn&rsquo;t work against the movie. The supporting roles were all good example of traditional Hollywood character acting and I thoroughly enjoyed that. FinallyI&#39;m sure lots of viewers kept seeing Keitel or DeNiro in the Nicholson role but he was doing an appropriate job, mixing some low key acting with his typical over the top fare.</span></p>

</p>

[Servo2000]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

[quote user=&quot;Fuuma&quot;]

Hi Jun, welcome!. Great to have yet another film lover onboard!</p>

You might have seen, for exemple, that I genuinely enjoyed the Belmondo vehicule &quot;Le magnifique&quot; (and countless others Belmondo moviesfor that matter) or British crime movie &quot;Get carter&quot;. Those are personal choices that I&#39;m not sure many cinephile share or recognize as favorites. So I&#39;m wondering what are your own cinematic &quot;quirks&quot;.[/quote]
</p>

To take another break from the high brow, if you&#39;re referring to the Michael Caine version of Get Carter, then I&#39;m with you.</p>

On a side note, I really enjoyed this documentary on the Hikikomori phenomon by Francesco Jodice. I think it&#39;s about 20 minutes long, you can view it at his website: http://www.francescojodice.com/VHikEn.htm. Some of our japanese posters might know about it as well, it&#39;ll be interesting to hear what you cinema fanatics think of it, you film otakus.</p>

[casem]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

Wow, I I&#39;m not as much of a film buff as many of you, though I recognize some of what was posted from when I took French Film is college (Ent&#39;racte, Un Chien Andalou). The last thing I saw was Gondry&#39;s Science of Sleep. I really loved it, all the effects are so homeade but the whole film really left an impression on me. It&#39;s just such unrestrained creativity and association, I really got caught up in it even though it lacks much of a plot. My all time favorites are:<div>- Party Monster</div><div>- A Home at the End of the World</div><div>- Dancer in the Dark</div><div>- The Gleaner&#39;s and I</div><div>- The Dreamers</div><div>- Mysterious Skin</div>

[Fuuma]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

[quote user=&quot;Servo2000&quot;][quote user=&quot;Fuuma&quot;]

Hi Jun, welcome!. Great to have yet another film lover onboard!</p>

You might have seen, for exemple, that I genuinely enjoyed the Belmondo vehicule &quot;Le magnifique&quot; (and countless others Belmondo moviesfor that matter) or British crime movie &quot;Get carter&quot;. Those are personal choices that I&#39;m not sure many cinephile share or recognize as favorites. So I&#39;m wondering what are your own cinematic &quot;quirks&quot;.[/quote] </p>

To take another break from the high brow, if you&#39;re referring to the Michael Caine version of Get Carter, then I&#39;m with you.</p>

On a side note, I really enjoyed this documentary on the Hikikomori phenomon by Francesco Jodice. I think it&#39;s about 20 minutes long, you can view it at his website: http://www.francescojodice.com/VHikEn.htm. Some of our japanese posters might know about it as well, it&#39;ll be interesting to hear what you cinema fanatics think of it, you film otakus.</p>

[/quote]</p>

</p>

Yeah, the one where Michael Caine plays Carter not the Stalone remake (where Caine also stars but in a different role). Hikikomori are those tota recluses that spend their whole lives in their rooms right, I&#39;ll check the doc out as such refusal of social interaction really is a fascinating/grotesque reaction to the pressures of rigid social normative constructs. This isn&#39;t new though, I&#39;d say i,ve heard the term about 8yrs ago or something like that (end of 90s, maybe early 2000s at most).</p>

[Fuuma]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

[quote user=&quot;casem83&quot;]Wow, I I&#39;m not as much of a film buff as many of you, though I recognize some of what was posted from when I took French Film is college (Ent&#39;racte, Un Chien Andalou). The last thing I saw was Gondry&#39;s Science of Sleep. I really loved it, all the effects are so homeade but the whole film really left an impression on me. It&#39;s just such unrestrained creativity and association, I really got caught up in it even though it lacks much of a plot. My all time favorites are: <div>- Party Monster</div><div>- A Home at the End of the World</div><div>- Dancer in the Dark</div><div>- The Gleaner&#39;s and I</div><div>- The Dreamers</div><div>- Mysterious Skin</div>

[/quote]</p>

</p>

That remind me I need to check out the dreamers, and maybe science of sleep.</p>

[mass]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread


i haven't seen under the sun of satan, is it something you would recommend? diary of a country priest if i remember correctly is also tarkovsky's all time favorite film



a friend of mine tells me they filmed (not sure how much) the departed in nyc, which doesn't make sense to me. anyways it started off really really promising (in gritty scorsese style. fyi i was really dissapointed in his last 2 films, and i think bringing out the dead is grossly underrated, etc) but it just got weird for me. i don't think i ever saw deniro in the role, maybe it was too obvious or maybe i had just watched from dusk til dawn a few days earlier; i think nicholson did an ok job but he just reminded me of the joker (my friend says it's because he hasn't done a role like that since joker, which makes sense, but in a way it also reminded me of him in that adam sandler film. i guess i'm just not a huge fan of eccentric-nicholson. one flew over the cuckoo's nest is the obvious exception). i just don't think he 'fits' the role, esp when compared with his character from IA. alsooo SPOILERS AHEAD>>>>>>>>>> i didn't understand the inclusion of the goofy black guy (from romeo must die, etc. sorry, i'd google his name but i'm in the middle of a conf call. believe me when i say my friends and i still refer to jason statham as 'turkish')... maybe just to throw off everyone who had seen IA? i loved wahlberg's character though! and baldwin to an extent. i also really liked matt damon in this... and i haven't liked him in anything other than rounders and good will hunting (somebody once wrote, and this won't be funny at all since i'm paraphrasing, "if goodwill hunting came out today would you ever believe a movie starring matt damon, robin williams and ben affleck could be good?"). also, listening to those chinese dealers/gangsters/etc. speak cantonese was painful. it would've been cool if he could've gotten someone from IA to make a cameo.


[quote user="Fuuma"]

[quote user=&quot;mass&quot;]i really love bresson... i love mouchette, although to be honest it took me a few tries before i could get through all of diary of a country priest in one sitting... i watched the departed last week... kind of dissapointed because i thought it started off extremely well. nobody agrees with me that harvey keitel would&#39;ve played the part better than jack nicholson, either. looking forward to borat soon...[/quote]</p>

<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial">I think the two adaptation of Bernanos novels I saw (diary of a country priest-Bresson and Under the sun ofSatan-Pialat)were pretty amazing in the depth with which they explored the meaning of faith, especially how their Christ-like characters were unsuited (too pure?)to daily life as members of small, rural communities. It&#39;s interesting to note that Pialat was definitely a non-believer, contrary to Bresson, which didn&#39;t stop him from making a deeply mystical film. He, of course, mixed it with his usual brand of conflicted characters all fragility and defiance clashing against each others in extreme contexts (death, love, suicide, etc.) but stayed away from his typical naturalism for amore literary style that made me think, in a way, of Bresson&#39;s direction (with emotion addedin the mix...).</span></p>

<span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial">I saw the Departed and actually enjoyed the movie. The story is pretty much the same as Infernal Affairs but the treatment is what makes it different, IA is a sleek, modern, tightly editedthriller all steely blues and greys set in the &quot;high rise jungle&quot; not a well made cop/gangster drama with interesting characterizations, a 70s editing style (no MTV for you!!) and a good depiction of Boston slums and urban decay. DiCaprio is certainly not a great actor and almost unbelievable as any form of tough guy but I guess Scorsese&#39;s talent made me forget that a little. As for Damon he can only play a clean-cut, up and coming preppy young man and thankfully that&#39;s what the role entailed, which means his small range didn&rsquo;t work against the movie. The supporting roles were all good example of traditional Hollywood character acting and I thoroughly enjoyed that. FinallyI&#39;m sure lots of viewers kept seeing Keitel or DeNiro in the Nicholson role but he was doing an appropriate job, mixing some low key acting with his typical over the top fare.</span></p>

</p>[/quote]

[casem]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

Has anyone seen Drawing Restraint 9? I&#39;m a huge Bjork fan, I&#39;ve got the soundtrack she did for it and it is possibly the strangest thing she has done. I wonder if it&#39;s worth seeing or if it is too out there to be enjoyable.

[Fuuma]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman">I would definitely recommend Under the sun of Satan, but not as your first Pialat as it&rsquo;s a departure from his usual style. &Agrave; nos amours is incredibly good and now available on criterion so you should have no problems finding it, I&rsquo;d say it would be a good idea to go with that.</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman"></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman">As for The Departed well the Nicholson character is definitely a DeNiro role but the man has really let us down in his last performance, which is a shame when you consider his talent. I guess he wasn&rsquo;t bad in The Score (2001) and Ronin (1998) but that was a while ago..</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman"></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman">Concerning IA: well I think Eric Tsang&rsquo;s performance was pretty exceptional, but he&rsquo;s one of a handful of HK character actors who I quite enjoy seeing in this kind of role. </font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman"></font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0cm 0cm 0pt"><span lang="EN-CA" style="font-size: 10pt"><font face="Times New Roman">On another note when I heard the Chinese gangsters in The Departed speak Cantonese I just assumed Chinese government agents went with one of the powerful HK triad to handle the deal, it didn&rsquo;t seem that off to me but maybe you&rsquo;re right and it&rsquo;s just a glaring mistake.</font></span></p>

[Faust]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread



Bored: posting my Netflix Que.</p><table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="qtbl"><tbody><tr><td class="st"></td><td class="sr"></td><td class="sm"></td><td class="sc"></td><td class="sa"></td><td class="srm"></td></tr>
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<td class="h" style="padding-left: 2px">Priority</td>
<td class="h">Movie Title</td>

<td class="h">Star Rating</td>

<td align="center" class="h">MPAA</td>
<td class="h">Genre</td>
<td class="h">Availability</td>

<td align="center" class="h"><table cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr valign="bottom"><td class="h">Remove</td><td align="center" class="h" style="padding-left: 7px">Move to Top</td></tr></tbody></table></td>
</tr>
</tbody></table>


<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="qtbl">
<tbody><tr><td class="sp"></td><td class="st"></td><td class="sr"></td><td class="sm"></td><td class="sc"></td><td class="sa"></td><td class="srm"></td></tr>
<tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR60026141" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="1" /><input name="OP60026141" type="hidden" value="1" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Irreversible</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM60026141_90529_1_1" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M60026141_90529_1_1&#39;, 1, 28,event)">


</div>
</td><td class="ec">UR</td><td class="e">Foreign</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60026141" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR60011325" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="2" /><input name="OP60011325" type="hidden" value="2" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">The Remains of the Day</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM60011325_90529_1_2" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M60011325_90529_1_2&#39;, 1, 37,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">PG-13</td><td class="e">Drama</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60011325" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR70043621" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="3" /><input name="OP70043621" type="hidden" value="3" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Seamless</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM70043621_90529_1_3" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M70043621_90529_1_3&#39;, 1, 29,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">NR</td><td class="e">Documentary</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R70043621" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR60011023" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="4" /><input name="OP60011023" type="hidden" value="4" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">The Battle of Algiers</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM60011023_90529_1_4" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M60011023_90529_1_4&#39;, 1, 40,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">UR</td><td class="e">Foreign</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60011023" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR60032450" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="5" /><input name="OP60032450" type="hidden" value="5" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Naked Lunch</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM60032450_90529_1_5" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M60032450_90529_1_5&#39;, 1, 33,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">R</td><td class="e">Drama</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60032450" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR1093793" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="6" /><input name="OP1093793" type="hidden" value="6" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Videodrome</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM1093793_90529_1_6" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M1093793_90529_1_6&#39;, 1, 33,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">G</td><td class="e">Children &amp; Family</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60027106" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR60003330" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="8" /><input name="OP60003330" type="hidden" value="8" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Wall Street</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM60003330_90529_1_8" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M60003330_90529_1_8&#39;, 1, 33,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">R</td><td class="e">Drama</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R60003330" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR247351" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="9" /><input name="OP247351" type="hidden" value="9" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Amadeus</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM247351_90529_1_9" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M247351_90529_1_9&#39;, 1, 37,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">PG</td><td class="e">Drama</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R247351" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr></tbody></table>
<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="qtbl"><tbody><tr><td class="sp"></td><td class="st"></td><td class="sr"></td><td class="sm"></td><td class="sc"></td><td class="sa"></td><td class="srm"></td></tr>
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</td><td class="ec">NR</td><td class="e">Documentary</td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R70043440" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr><tr class="s"><td colspan="7"></td></tr><tr class="bd"><td class="qn"><input class="o" maxlength="3" name="OR21477356" onblur="TB(this)" onfocus="TF(this)" value="11" /><input name="OP21477356" type="hidden" value="11" /></td><td class="et"><div class="stc">Ladies and Gentlemen, Mr. Leonard Cohen</div></td><td align="center"><div class="fwdgt" id="wM21477356_90529_1_11" onmouseover="wR(&#39;M21477356_90529_1_11&#39;, 1, 27,event)">


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</td><td class="ec">UR</td><td class="e">Music &amp; Musicals </td><td class="e"><div class="sac">Now</div></td><td class="c"><input name="R21477356" onclick="T(this);" type="checkbox" /></td></tr></tbody></table>

</p>

[xcoldricex]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread



[quote user=&quot;mass&quot;]



a friend of mine tells me they filmed (not sure how much) the departed in nyc, which doesn&#39;t make sense to me. anyways it started off really really promising (in gritty scorsese style. fyi i was really dissapointed in his last 2 films, and i think bringing out the dead is grossly underrated, etc) but it just got weird for me. i don&#39;t think i ever saw deniro in the role, maybe it was too obvious or maybe i had just watched from dusk til dawn a few days earlier; i think nicholson did an ok job but he just reminded me of the joker (my friend says it&#39;s because he hasn&#39;t done a role like that since joker, which makes sense, but in a way it also reminded me of him in that adam sandler film. i guess i&#39;m just not a huge fan of eccentric-nicholson. one flew over the cuckoo&#39;s nest is the obvious exception). i just don&#39;t think he &#39;fits&#39; the role, esp when compared with his character from IA. alsooo SPOILERS AHEAD&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; i didn&#39;t understand the inclusion of the goofy black guy (from romeo must die, etc. sorry, i&#39;d google his name but i&#39;m in the middle of a conf call. believe me when i say my friends and i still refer to jason statham as &#39;turkish&#39;)... maybe just to throw off everyone who had seen IA? i loved wahlberg&#39;s character though! and baldwin to an extent. i also really liked matt damon in this... and i haven&#39;t liked him in anything other than rounders and good will hunting (somebody once wrote, and this won&#39;t be funny at all since i&#39;m paraphrasing, &quot;if goodwill hunting came out today would you ever believe a movie starring matt damon, robin williams and ben affleck could be good?&quot;). also, listening to those chinese dealers/gangsters/etc. speak cantonese was painful. it would&#39;ve been cool if he could&#39;ve gotten someone from IA to make a cameo.[/quote]</p>


haha i totally agree. that guy made me think of harold and kumar (where he played a burger drive-thru guy..</p>

also, listening to those chinese dealers/gangsters/etc. speak cantonese
was painful. it would&#39;ve been cool if he could&#39;ve gotten someone from
IA to make a cameo.

</p>

haha i think i said this exact same thing over at SF. anyway i liked IA a lot more.
</p>

[mass]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

yeah... i dunno. actually i just read the other day that de niro was signed on to be in it, but i don't know for what part. i'm thinking martin sheen's role? anyway i am looking forward to the good shepard...




so the past week...


watched borat, enjoyed it very much.



watched exiled, i enjoyed this immensley as well. lots of powdered blood (the best kind). pacing was kind of iffy though.



watched my unsubbed copy le deuxieme souffle. i have a subtitled vhs copy somewhere but i don't think my vcr likes it. i was in montreal last week and i'm preetttyyyy sure i saw a poster for this, but i was half awake so i could've dreamt it. anyways it turns out they are remaking this with daniel auteuil as gu. i don't like the sound of that. monica bellucci is in it also. ALSO, eric cantona is in it, for the football fans. hate man utd. but cantona may be my favorite football player ever.




watched bring me the head of alfredo garcia, which i have always really really loved.



watched you, me and dupree. it was on tv



caught the first 5 minutes of the devil wears prada. heh.

[Faust]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

I watched Irreversible yesterday. What a gruesome film. I have to say, sometimes I wonder about whether films like these should exist (same goes for something like Requiem for a Dream). The balance of sheer portrayal of violence by far outweighed the social and psychological points the film addressed (revenge, fate, etc.). The camera work was pretty amazing though - a bit too much at times, but mostly well done and innovative.

[Servo2000]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread

I noticed that on your list of films and was tempted to say just that, but frankly, it seems like a lot of people had just the opposite opinion, so I left you to it.

[Faust]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread



[quote user=&quot;Servo2000&quot;]I noticed that on your list of films and was tempted to say just that, but frankly, it seems like a lot of people had just the opposite opinion, so I left you to it.[/quote]</p>

I would love to hear what their opinion is in detail.</p>

[xcoldricex]

Re: Photography is truth. The cinema is truth twenty-four times per second: The cinema thread



anyone a fan of shunji iwai?</p>