Rick Owens

[hobo]

leather that cracks doesn't sound luxurious to me.. sounds like waste..

Who want's water in their boots? excuse the simplicity of my argument but that is what counts really? Can i see pictures of this cracking please.

Also which boots did you get from ss07 Beardown?

My boots won't let the water in. I don't think so anyway. It's just the surface that cracks, not all the way through.

Hobo, what you're saying is oddly opposite to my understanding of cordovan (cordoba). Shell cordovan is the most heavy duty and densest part of the horse butt and it is certainly never supposed to crack. It is dense but still supple so it creates nice rolls and folds and even resists scuffing. They've been using it for dress shoes for quite a long time and under those circumstances it certainly doesn't crack. People would be very unhappy in that case not to mention the aesthetics of a clean dress shoe would be lost.

In my own leather sourcing, utilization and research I've found that any leather that cracks at stress/fold points instead of bends is sub-par and won't last long. Cracking means the leather is breaking and not bending so durability certainly becomes an issue then!

At the same time, I haven't seen a pair of Augustas that have cracked. The leather on the pairs that I've seen has worn nicely.

From your description hobo, it sounds like the (shell) cordovan pair is the one that creases and not cracks and the other pair is made of the lower grade leather!

I won't argue this point too much because it sounds like you know far more about leather than I do, but I'm sure that the ones that crack are the Cordoba ones. My point is that they have been treated so that the surface cracks as you ware them. It is only the very surface that cracks, so I don't think that it affects the overall integrity of the leather. They were already pretty distressed when I saw the samples and I did discuss the effect with Simone at the time. I understand that this is not normally what one looks for in Cordovan leather but that is exactly my point. Maybe Rick had meant for his boots to crack and age. That is the way he designs most of his other leather products. I’ve seen leathers that I’ve liked and ones that I haven’t but that is a subjective thing and clearly some were more expensive than others, but none of them could have damaged his reputation. If the boots in his ’09 collection do crack and it’s not deliberate, at the prices paid, I’d say that that’s pretty poor and definitely puts a big dent in his rep.

[Faust]

Maybe you guys have different definitions of crack. Maybe visuals would be helpful here (and I don't mean visuals of THAT crack).

[Chinorlz]

I hope I didn't come off as caustic or disbelieving Hobo, i'm genuinely interested in the subject and the individual approach to leather treatments/aesthetic especially in Rick and Simone's cases amongst others! I certainly am no expert... the world of leather is so vast that there are always many new things to learn. :)

you brought an interesting new facet to the discussion with the information you posted up and I wanted to delve deeper into it :)

I think I'm getting a better idea of what you mean by cracking now. Initially my mental image was of not-well-taken-care-of or cheap leathers with fissure like cracks but if it's more of a superficial cracking then it becomes more interesting.

Like Faust said, love to see some shots!

[tlack]

Yup,
Guess I am easy to spot. The one drawback with the boots is that everyone looks at your feet and thinks you are
a. A Fireman on his way to a basketball game or
b. A lunatic, it's summer, wtf are you wearing?

That's a ballsy combination. I'm going to need to see a photo of this.

I'm so fucking upset with myself that I didn't splurge on those elephant boots when they were on oki-ni.

[Heirloom]

I want a combinaton of the wedges and the elephant boots. that would rock. I don't care much for the crepe sole on the boots but i love the chunky feel.

[cabl3]

In regards to the leather issue, Chrinolz is right about how horse cordovan, when creased, creates subtle rolls/bends, and doesnt show cracks as easily as your other cuts or leathers (I have no experience with Cordoba cuts from other skins)...but I guess a good comparison is the common Calf skin.

I believe that the added cracking to the mentioned Augusta boots would be due to a treatment given to them.

And yes the cracking mentioned in general in this thread obviously doesnt refer to a sign of deterioration or weakness in the leather, but rather the superficial cracks/bends that naturally occur on any kind of leather footwear.

I'd imagine it would be intentional in Rick's case, and go as far as to say that just as each season has a different lineup, he perhaps has a different idea of how these particular boots should wear in.

[dji]

I believe the boots hobo is referring to are of the salt enzyme aged box calf leather variety. they've obviously intentionally been treated in order for the surface of the leather to crack and weather in a unique way, it's not like the leather itself is splitting or anything.

[jcotteri]

I can't visualize the cracking of leather (even the very most top layers) without it creating a point of weakness and ruining it, with water and other things getting into the leather.

I am also thinking that Shell Cordovan was made from the muscle under the horses rump. hence you can get Shell and non Shell Cordovan? perhaps i'm wrong.. The Cordovan being above the rump.

[Chinorlz]

I believe the boots hobo is referring to are of the salt enzyme aged box calf leather variety. they've obviously intentionally been treated in order for the surface of the leather to crack and weather in a unique way, it's not like the leather itself is splitting or anything.

Love to see a shot of this as I didn't know that Simone did a shoe this way. The only "damaged" leather that I've seen from him is the Atelier edition footwear.

[dji]

sorry A, I was referring to rick's boots from the last couple of seasons.

[Chinorlz]

sorry A, I was referring to rick's boots from the last couple of seasons.

Oh no worries :)

At least you are on topic of the thread while I was going on about Augusta hahaha

[hobo]

In regards to the leather issue, Chrinolz is right about how horse cordovan, when creased, creates subtle rolls/bends, and doesnt show cracks as easily as your other cuts or leathers (I have no experience with Cordoba cuts from other skins)...but I guess a good comparison is the common Calf skin.

I believe that the added cracking to the mentioned Augusta boots would be due to a treatment given to them.

And yes the cracking mentioned in general in this thread obviously doesnt refer to a sign of deterioration or weakness in the leather, but rather the superficial cracks/bends that naturally occur on any kind of leather footwear.

I'd imagine it would be intentional in Rick's case, and go as far as to say that just as each season has a different lineup, he perhaps has a different idea of how these particular boots should wear in.

Exactly!

I believe the boots hobo is referring to are of the salt enzyme aged box calf leather variety. they've obviously intentionally been treated in order for the surface of the leather to crack and weather in a unique way, it's not like the leather itself is splitting or anything.

You're absolutely right. Cordovan leather is horsehide (in my limited experience), and my boots are Cordovan leather. I was typing and not thinking!

[theaddict]

Guys, Rick has landed at komakino...And i really got a problem...the new high collar leather is soooo nice...and the samurai coat too...but i have money only for one...the leather is made of the oiled calfskin. Very heavy and very substantial...can anyone share his feelings and experiences with this leather with me? Its definitely different and more substantial from AW08, thus the collar holds its shape quite nicely. Or is there a party who absolutely detests it compared to lambskin? (haha, same discussion like one year ago...)

[AKA*NYC]

imo that oiled calfskin is the best leather this season

[Faust]

Man, can't wait to see what you got in, addict! Once we see the photos, we'll decide!