Rick Owens

[Faust]

Read my article on Rick instead

[Nickefuge]

I sometimes watch that NY Times "In The Studio" bit with him when I'm stressed. It's a very soothing video!

Same here!

[Nomadic Planet]

going back to the Moldova / Italy thing, anyone knows when did Rick started moving the production to Moldova?

My guess is around 2010, because everything I see from earlier (2008, 2009) still has the made in Italy label, and everything starting 2011 / Limo seems to already have the Moldova tag.

and from what I understand , only leather jackets are concerned by this "sewn in Moldova" thing... is that correct?

thx!

[DudleyGray]

F/W 2012 seems to be when people started noticing the Moldova label, but S/S 2012 is possible.

It seems naive to presume that only a certain style of item is manufactured in Moldova at this point. And as long as you're buying new Rick, you're supporting that practice, even if you're not buying the Moldova-specific pieces. FWIW, it's less an issue of quality, because quality is still amazing, possibly even better overall, but this might be more due to design decisions than actual labor. I think it's more an issue of ethics and I guess status, if you're into that sort of thing.

[Faust]

At the end of the day we don't know unless we go and see the manufacturing facilities. So, you can err on the side of caution, or not, but it's difficult to make sweeping claims, because it's still a conjecture.

[Nomadic Planet]

^ I agree

+ why would Rick be transparent about the leathers being "sewn in Moldova" and not the rest?

Leather jacket tags clearly state "sewn in Moldova - origin of leather, treatment of leather, pattern, sizing, cut in Italy" ...

but they don't say "made in Italy" at all; whereas all footwear still says Made in Italy (and many garments too, all my drkshdw stuff still says that, and also the few mainline items I have if I remember correctly).

[unwashed]

It's sad that businesses in general are not more transparent about their production processes and sources. I think if a business isn't open or transparent at all, well you can guess what they're hiding.

But even though the stuff is made in Italy and they are completely transparent about their sewingplants it says nothing about the raw materials etc... What about these, the horn buttons, the silk, the cotton how is this sourced? We don't know...

All production uses a form of polluting the environment or harming human working standards of some kind. I cannot think of a single company who is completely transparent about their production and materialsources while being also environment/labor friendly. It's a good thing the earth knows how to recover itself, but it can't do anything about companies set up in the cheapest countries in the world, so the labor problem will likely stay.

[Nomadic Planet]

it wasn't my intention to open again this debate / discussion about sourcing and wages etc.
I was just curious about when did the Moldova thing started!

so probably around SS12 ? can anyone owning a leather from ss12 confirm?
and are we sure that 2010 pieces were still made in Italy?

I know transparency and ethics in Capitalism are complicated issues in general and in the fashion industry in particular (+ the relevance of the brand's ethos we value around here bc they are not fast fashion zara etc), but I would assume that probably Rick himself has nothing to do directly with this decision... that would be my guess. Probably some CFO / finance director etc. looking to run the company in the best way possible has pushed in that direction (I remember having read somewhere that Rick is not the CEO of his own brand, which makes sense) and as long there's a level of quality that can be guaranteed Rick is ok with that...? the truth is I don't know, and I guess many around here don't know neither, so we are just speculating. Probably production costs are lower, that is for sure; but maybe workers there are still being paid correctly.

Again the problem at a macro level is about what are the rules of the game. Sadly, Capitalism can't rely on each individual / company's ethics to ensure a fair system. Capitalism is not about justice or fairness, but about efficiency. The rules of the game allow poor working conditions and poor wages, there will always be some company that will want to take advantage of that.
We as a consumers still have the choice of not supporting those brands, and I'm aware that part of the SZ ethos is about that. However we don't really know what is happening at the RO factories there and we are just speculating.

[Faust]

http://www.honestby.com, the Bruno Pieters project.

And, absolutely, Geoffrey B. Small

But I fear we might be derailing this thread...

[unwashed]

Geoffrey maybe?

edit: honestby is pretty good at transparency, best I can tell.

^^Yes true. And yes drifting off hijacking RO's thread...Will stop with this post

^ Yes these are usual suspects that pop up in my mind, but I think even GBS sources it's fabrics somewhere else (might it be by the finest Italian manufactures though).

And then you can ask yourself, are they being vegetable dyed, how about the companies waste solution, where does the wood/horn/mother of pearl for the buttons come from. And then transport, everything by diesel fueled boats, plains, etc.. What are the work conditions for people working at the boats.

Maybe it's just the circle of life... It would be interesting to sustain your own life completely and independent. But then you won't look as cool and apocalyptic or ninja like, however more PH like

[Faust]

Dude, dig deep enough and you end up in Camus territory. I'd rather not. As Saul Bellow once wrote, there is simply too much to think about.

[Nomadic Planet]

yes indeed, thread derailing alert!

if anyone can comment on where are made RO leathers from 2010 and 2011 (anyone actually owning one would be great), that would be a nice way of getting the thread back on track.

I have two leathers from Mountain (FW12) and both are made in Moldova; plus a third leather which I don't know the season (something between 2011 and 2013 would be my guess, still racagni zippers), also made in Moldova.

[unwashed]

True, good quote. Makes me justify my RO purchases at LN-CC. Hypocrite I am

[josecc]

yes indeed, thread derailing alert!

if anyone can comment on where are made RO leathers from 2010 and 2011 (anyone actually owning one would be great), that would be a nice way of getting the thread back on track.

I have two leathers from Mountain (FW12) and both are made in Moldova; plus a third leather which I don't know the season (something between 2011 and 2013 would be my guess, still racagni zippers), also made in Moldova.

Hi, 2010-2011 all made in Italy. Some FW12 shearlings made in Italy. I have a FW13 leather made in Italy too.

[LOVE]

mountain leather MII, checking in.

sorry if this has been addressed already, but has anyone noticed major visual differences between the labels of two pieces from the same season? looking @ two labels from VICIOUS right now, the typeface on both is different, one is also about 3 pts. larger than the other font. i've also noticed this from ISLAND with both the typeface and the color of the label being different on two items. the provenance of everything is good i'm not really worried about fakes, is there another explanation?