Where to start...

[Seventh]

Re: Where to start...



Wow, fantastic responses from everyone... really interesting.

Fuuma your post was great and reminds me of some of John Cage's "Rules and Hints for Students and Teachers" (if you have been around an art school, you have probably come across it, still, words to live by)...

2. Find a place you trust and then, try trusting it for a while.
3. (General duties as a student)
   
   Pull everything out of your teacher. Pull everything out of your fellow students.
4. (General rules as a teacher)
   
   Pull everything out of your students.
5. Consider everything an experiment
6. Be self-disciplined. This means finding someone wise or smart and choosing to follow
   them. To be disciplined is to follow in a good way. To be self-disciplined is to follow in
   a better way.
7. Follow the leader. Nothing is a mistake. There is no win or fail. There is only make.
8. The only rule is work. If you work it will lead to
   something. It is the people who do all of the work all the time who
   eventually catch on to things. You can fool the fans but not the
   players.
9. Do not try to create and analyze at the same time. They are two different processes.
10. Be happy whenever you can manage it. Enjoy yourself. It is lighter than you think.
11. We are breaking all the rules, even our own rules and how do we do that? By leaving
    enough room for the ?x? qualities. Helpful hints always be around. Come or go to
    everything. Always go to class. Read everything you can get your hands on. Look at
    movies carefully and often. Save everything. It may come in handy later.

[soultek]

Re: Where to start...



Wow, this has been an interesting read. Everyone has had great things to say, I only have a couple points.

I'd second what was said about buying cheaply first to sort of find your style. H&M, Uniqlo (if you're in NYC), department store sales, even some stuff from banana or similar brands. I think the biggest mistake I've made in the last few years is spending too much on things I was unsure of. If you spend some time in cheaper versions of these clothes first, perhaps you could make more informed higher priced purchases.

Also, I pitfall I recently fell into was the work/play wardrobe problem. My initial thing was to sort of have my wardrobe be versatile enough so that it could be adapted to both. I work in a corporate environment, so it's pretty much button ups and khaki's. After some years of this, I've come to realize that my work wardrobe made me stick out (mainly due to the 'tailored' look), and my play wardrobe was getting kinda boring and conservative. I've since thought that I should just split the two of them up.

So I said all of that to say this: a good place to start is the workplace. Everyone sees the benefit of looking 'professional' in the workplace (whether you're a DJ or an accountant), there are more established 'rules' in the work place (no matter your profession). Start with these boundaries, and see what you like/don't. Many people say that 'casual' dressing (or what you wear when you're not at work) is the hardest thing, because there are so many possibilities.

well, hope this helps.

[matthewhk]

Re: Where to start...



[quote user="xcoldricex"]i wholeheartedly agree with no. 2 and no. 3. i think some people are too uptight about their "style" and take themselves too seriously.
[/quote]

hah this post i feel was speakin directly at me...i must admit i'm guilty of this quite often. I have to step back when i get carried away and look at it in the perspective of fuuma's no.3. That was a great post.

[Buckwheat]

Re: Where to start...



Great discussion. Thank you for sharing everyone.

[lowrey]

Re: Where to start...



[quote user="casem83"]Great advice from everyone. I would also like to add, try not to spend too much $$$while you are finding your style. I shopped mostly at outlets when I was first getting into designer stuff (outlets can be dangerous though, much of it is there for a reason). Also remember, most stuff can be found on sale, when I was still learning I had no idea designer collections went on sale twice a year, I thought they were above sales and I was afraid to ask, but I was totally wrong.I hardly wear anything I bought 3 years ago, I bought lots of "jean brands" like Diesel, Energie, D&G, and I wish I wouldn't have spent so much on all that. But it's a learning process so I don't regret it, those brands spoke to me at the time and I felt good wearing them.[/quote]

thats one very important point.

many years ago I was wearing loose fittingjeans and loose t-shirts, when I started to change my style I boughtsome designer stuff and things like "premium" jeans from malls. needless to say, I wore stuff like that for half a year untill I started to develop a more detailed taste. I had updated my wardrobe quite a lot and then I had to sell many things because my taste and style were still evolving.

so what I mean is that when you start the process of developing your style and updating your wardrobe, dont spent $10,000 in a week. buy some items first, use them for a while and see where your style goes. then buy something else and get the hang of how youre taste is evolving.

[nairb49]

Re: Where to start...



Ha! Terrific posts from everyone.

In a way, I'm a bit jealous. I suppose I could relate it to most sports, where (generally) the most fun is the stage where your learning curve is the steepest. And then when you get to a certain point, you start to plateau.

But then, SZ comes along and it starts all over again.... ;)

[cjbreed]

Yourself; yes; when you're happy with it.

i'd say this is mostly right, but sometimes it really helps to listen to what others have to say. i think on forums like this, there is a wealth of info and insight that can be gained from each other through waywt's etc. fashion "rules" are likely to be rejected, or treated more as suggestions than rules.

like the sleeveless hoodie+vest/tank+vest idea. there is no rule for that, but most of the time it will look wrong (like a boxer making his way to the ring or something). but i think(?) there is a waywt with andrewislasorad making it look great in a rick to toe outfit that most people could never pull off. perhaps you have found a way to make it look right as well? only you have the final say, but for me it helps to listen to the opinions of those whose style i trust...

[cjbreed]

If I do muay thai / martial arts is it wrong to have elements of the warzone?
Most people have been telling me it looks wrong, you can see for yourself on page 861 in the WAYWT thread.

Can you find the picture of the one you're talking about with the vest + sleeveless?

not sure if andrew will mind but it can be found here:
tank+vest

looks great on him but maybe not the look you're going for...

also, i just saw your waywt post and in all honesty and kindness my advice is to lurk more. here, styleforum, sufu, whatever, until you've found something a little more cohesive to call your "personal style". you don't want to look dressed by the internets but you also don't want to look dressed in the dark. try to find consistency in the garments you wear together, in terms of materials, aesthetics, etc. in other words, one or two pricey items (bespoke lace-ups) will not pull together an outfit whose principle components are made by american apparel. its tough to bring together athletic/casual gear with upscale/dress clothes.

I'm not saying everyone else won't hate it, I just think dressing to impress other people is a thankless task. If you feel totally kickass in a sleeveless hoodie and a vest, then that's what you should wear. I won't like what you're wearing, but you will.

this is true, and i don't suggest dressing to impress others. but i do want to be told if i look like an ass...

[Faust]

What would be an example of a bright earthy tone? Sounds like an oxymoron to me.

As etruscan told you in WAYWT thread, I'd start by looking at old collections - lots of them. First see if anything jumps out at you. That's always a good start. Your inner self is often the best judge. I think you should also take a trip to New York and make rounds in stores, touch the garments, try them on, see how different designers fit. Do they cut for your body type or not?

Next, I would think about fabrics. Read up on them - what are charecteristics of each. Think about where you live, the climate, etc. What fabrics are expensive, which ones are cheap, etc.

Lastly, think more about yourself, as you've already started. What is it exactly that you want to project, if anything.

Don't jump into buying things - too many people commit the mistake of buying on the internet and then regretting it.

Don't do these things and you will end up a fashion victim. SZ has its victims too.

[Faust]

colors like these?:



Yes I've done that before, jumping into buying things, especially before I was even on a fashion forum. It's unavoidable, no? Most things you aren't able to try on or are very hard to find. and sometimes your style changes from time to time.

I have a few B.son pieces but they are for fall/winter so right now I just wear lighter, cheaper stuff.. which may be why the cohesiveness is lacking.

New York sounds good, but I'm unfamiliar with the stores in that area and someone would have to show me around.

We have an NYC map with all the good stores pinned in the shopping section.

[eat me]

Catharsis, your first and fundamental mistake is to take inspiration from a costume musical drama. Depp looks good there, but only because the setting, the mood, the decor is right. You take him out in that outfit and put him on the street - it's going to look hideous. I'm not opposed to taking inspiration from cinema, but you have to know what you're doing. And no offense, but atm you clearly don't.

So perhaps it is better to you to chuck that hideous neo-victorian costume blend idea out of the window and just spend some time browsing through collections on any fashion site, and waywats on forums. Look for what inspires you. The reason to start with designers is simple - the amount of time and resources they spend to make sure everything looks right is massive, so you'll get a more or less clear idea about the right fits and proportions.

Creating a look is not as easy as picking the pieces you think will convey the desired mood, putting them on and making sure the colours match. That's the most basic level there is and it doesn't work when you're trying something more creative than a jock look. There's proportions, fabric differences, tones, etc. And even then it's just the technical side, not even the touching the emotional side of the subject.

So, to start you off, here's a look you might like by Mr Galliano himself. Even though I find this particular fit a bit off and not really what I'd wear, Galliano was a designer that inspired me to get into the whole fashion thing in the first place. It was a long time ago, but he's still great for the kind of "costume meets art meets fashion" inspiration.



http://men.style.com/fashion/designe...JGMEN/seasons/

[endorphinz]

A lot. Who made it matters to me. Marc Jacobs can make the best leather jacket in the world, I won't buy it. Is it snobbery? Not really - it's more antipathy to what I feel as a threat to how I feel about clothes. I genuinely feel that the likes of Louis Vuitton ARE the enemy.

Faust could you please explain this statement. I don't own anything by Marc Jacobs but I am curious as to why a label alone would turn you off. I find thinking like this troublesome but maybe I'm just not understanding you fully.

[Faust]

Perhaps it would be best explained in economic terms? Do you know an economic principle called scarcity? It states that there is a finite amount of money chasing a finite amount of real goods. So, I do not want to contribute my money to enriching Marc Jacobs, who stands for many things I detest in fashion - fakery, pomp, shallowness, celebrity worship, consumerism, hype. It's a matter of ideology. As one critic once aptly said, "Why would you want to buy anything from Prada - for what, so you can see her buy another house in Capri?"

I've relented on Jacobs a bit since that statement - at least he is fully conscious of what he's doing and does it with humor. There are bigger fishes to fry on the pan of my fashion wrath - Prada, Tom Ford, Dolce & Gabbana, Cavalli, etc... These people contribute nothing of value to this world.

[endorphinz]

so it's more of an "ethical, moral, political" choice and not really based on "fashion?"

I'd like to pose this question: would you feel the same way about the labels you currently wear if,in time, they exploded and became more omnipresent; if they were seen on celebs and were more commonplace and visible?

Would the finely crafted, beautifully styled pieces you currently own lose their appeal or would you still continue to enjoy them?

[rocknrollnigger]

if they were seen on celebs