random fashion thoughts

[gregor]

Agreed. Faust, I sincerely respect your words and your work. However, I deeply believe that kind of attitude is what got us here in the first place. Mainstream news are typically bullshit anyway, but I don't think that it is detrimental to at least be aware of current social and evironmental issues. This is not to become an "activist" or become a hardcore vegan, but simply to help us decide how lenient we are willing to be about the impact of our choices. I don't think that closing our eyes and covering our ears really does anything for anyone. At the end of the day, the problem is still there, and I think it is better to keep one's feet on the ground.

Also: WE are all participants in society (consumption of goods, housing, use/exploitation of land/labor), and thus WE are all part of it's problems and issues. This isn't a moral perspective, it is a realistic one.

does being a participant in society mean that you have an intrinsic vested interest in the well being of everyone else in said society, as well as it's functions, or merely your own? (still somewhat undecided as where i fall in answering, but i think it's a rather germane question)

depending how machiavellian you want to get with it, i think there's reasonable cases to be made for both answers to my above question.

now, i don't think what faust is attempting to get at is ignorance ( or indolence), deliberate or otherwise, so much as the conscious acknowledgement that it's a fool's errand to try and help every facet of society succeed, as that's impossible.

now, on the subject of school shootings, it's my opinion that is a retaliation for the hedonism and selfishness that creates the conditions and ability for someone to do such a horrendous thing. it's an indication of something wrong on a much bigger scale, as mental illness is a very large problem society will never be able to fix. recrimination for such evils and truculent nature zam alluded to is going to be a part of our society as long as it exists in it's present form.

[zamb]

Attention is a person's most valuable asset for well being, and I've gradually unplugged myself from all forms of social and mass media upon realizing this, this forum excepted. I admit that I like having a place of relative anonymity to fuck around on, where I don't have to care whether people will take what I say the wrong way because nobody is "real."

Like right now: zamb. Fuck you for writing off mental illness for killing sprees as overly simplistic "evil." What a stupid thing to think.

Dude, relax, and I'm not going to get into an FU match with you.
I am NOT writing off mental illness, I am aware of mental illness as a REAL issue I have to deal with even in my own family .If you want to have an intelligent discussion about this i am willing to do it with you. but if you are goint to get defensive and disrespectful you are not going to get me to go down that route.......

By your statements you have proven a point that is actually a part of the problem. Intolerance to any kind of idea, suggestion or viewpoint that is not accepted by the masses, so instead of challenging and intellectually refuting my position if you think its wrong you become defensive and disrespectful to it........

[DudleyGray]

Oh, I guess I misinterpreted this:

It is funny also that whenever a mass murderer gets loose and kills dozens of people, 95% of the time it is attributed to "mental evilness (ed: illness)" while most do not want to accept that there are just some people who are sadistic, evil and determined to create suffering and destruction among us.

Tone never conveys very well through text.

[julian_doe]

Okay, I'll keep it short.

Good, bad, right, wrong, benevolent, and evil are all dogmatic adjectives which can apply to anything and everything depending on the opinion and/or the intent of the orator. What I am trying to say is that when we buy clothes (and/or manufacture clothes), we most definitely have a choice in regards to what what we buy (or what we create). And also, in regards to social problems, I am offering the opinion that it is important to at least be aware of their existence because in one way or another we are all participants in this global ecosystem. I don't think that is farfetched.

[curiouscharles]

to sort of echo Dudley, and contest Zamb - there is no such thing as evil [that is a purely religious belief], there is only sociopathy [which is a form of.. wait for it, mental illness].

disclaimer: this post, while based on personal charles truths, is definitely intended to stir some pots.

[zamb]

to sort of echo Dudley, and contest Zamb - there is no such thing as evil [that is a purely religious belief], there is only sociopathy [which is a form of.. wait for it, mental illness].

disclaimer: this post, while based on personal charles truths, is definitely intended to stir some pots.

I am a religious man, but i am not fanatic and i surely know how to have a reasonably intellectual discussion even if I disagree with someones position
Can you tell me by what means to you conclude that there is no such thing as evil?
Why such a concept should be quarantined off to the realm of religion?
.......and even if it were a religious concept how does that in and of itself make evil nonexistent?

[DudleyGray]

On a more serious note, I just got a promotional email from an often maligned store notifying me that both Yeezy and Geoffrey B. Small are available for pre-order. I guess that can be its own punchline.

[julian_doe]

I am a religious man, but i am not fanatic and i surely know how to have a reasonably intellectual discussion even if I disagree with someones position
Can you tell me by what means to you conclude that there is no such thing as evil?
Why such a concept should be quarantined off to the realm of religion?
.......and even if it were a religious concept how does that in and of itself make evil nonexistent?

I think religion, faith, morals, and the belief of good/evil are all fruit from the same branch. Thus, they are all based on trust and opinions instead of proof. Some would consider the slight body modifications I have to be evil, and some would say some of my loved ones are evil for having had abortions. These opinions are irrelevant to me, and are assessments based on individual bias. So, yes, evil is nothing more than an opinion...just as good is.

[gregor]

On a more serious note, I just got a promotional email from an often maligned store notifying me that both Yeezy and Geoffrey B. Small are available for pre-order. I guess that can be its own punchline.

yeezy placed above geoffrey, forme, guidi, and andresen by a supposedly avant garde boutique is something i won't soon stop shaking my head at...

[stagename]

Are we in for another round? I'm always late to the party.

I'm pretty sure julian_doe is a social constructionist (or something along those lines) so his position I presume is that evil is socially constructed. So nothing (arguable but let's presume) is inherently evil, it is just constructed as such by society. For example you can go in some societies where educating women is evil, and cutting their clitoris is good. Moral relativism is an never-ending debate in philosophy and I don't think we'll solve it here so I suggest we move on and stay camped in our own positions.

Mental illnesses are also the product of social construction (hi Foucault), Bentall wrote a very entertaining piece on the subject.

On the initial subject, Faust, I'm struggling with the very same thoughts at the moment, so that was a timely contribution. I just don't know. Sometimes I want to fight the good fight. Other times, I'm like, why should I help people who either don't want to be helped (probably because they don't know they want/need it), or would f* me up if they were in my position. Now I'm leaning towards julian's point, that we need to care, but on the other hand I feel that caring is socially, hum, hindering, i.e., I might do better in life if I don't care. It's a pointy subject, and although the moral decision seems evident, I'm not sure if the sacrifice is worth the cost.

[zamb]

the idea that good and evil are social construct or relative concepts is ridiculous.

to harm or kill an individual who did absolutely nothing to you is EVIL
and I have to laugh at these things because we can argue all we want, I am sure if a robber backs you up in an alley with a gun to rape you girlfriend or take your wallet you wont contemplate for a second if his actions are good or evil. you will know precisely what they are without even considering it.

I am sure If a seller posts a CCP Boots in the classified collect your money through paypal and disappear after doing that to 6 people we won't argue that he is a good person or that good/ evil is relative because in such a case it will be PRETTY CLEAR to you......

there are a lot of Evil things done by people who are NOT mentally ill, who understand exactly what they are doing and only show remorse after they have been caught and don't want to have to deal with the consequences
I fear sometimes intellectualism and sophistry have made some of us really unwise. One thing I'm certain of, ideology cannot refute reality.

When Politicians engage in fear mongering to rally the bases and energize supporters to get votes, or blatantly lie to discredit the opponent, I am sure they are not sociopaths.......they know EXACTLY what they want to accomplish

[round]

spirituality > religion

[curiouscharles]

I am a religious man, but i am not fanatic and i surely know how to have a reasonably intellectual discussion even if I disagree with someones position
Can you tell me by what means to you conclude that there is no such thing as evil?
Why such a concept should be quarantined off to the realm of religion?
.......and even if it were a religious concept how does that in and of itself make evil nonexistent?

glad you replied, although i hope you understood implicitly that i was only trying to provoke [somewhat humorously, at that], in order to explore this question - as i definitely find it a intriguing subject for discussion.

i would never be so bold as to make any claim whether something is real, or not, or the creation of one school of thought, or another.

but, i do not necessarily believe, personally, in objectively good or evil people - i only believe, or can observe, people who either a) have empathy for others [ie - "do unto others"], or b) do not have empathy for others [the lack thereof, is the basic definition of a sociopath].

it is my belief that from a purely scientific lens, every "evil" action can be attributed to a lack of empathy for others, or rather - doing unto others as you would very much prefer they not do unto you.

the basic definition of sociopathy is a lack of said empathy, and therefore can largely be attributed to the source of any perceived vein of evil within human society.

the only thing i personally think is a mistake of believing in spiritual concepts of good, or evil - is that there is some inherently transcendental quality to these "alignments". or rather, that their roots exist beyond the realm of human explanation, or influence.

when they're discussed in such a way, it makes the concept of "evil" too easy to dismiss as beyond our control - which is largely counter productive.

too often this ethereal concept of good & evil [but mostly evil] is used by organized religion as a tool to motivate their constituents - largely via fear.

if you make evil something transcendental, a force beyond our control, or beyond the realm of explanation - it makes such tactics highly effective.

but, as you suggest, even if evil were purely a creation of religion itself [which i don't actually believe it is, i just think they're one glaring example of an institution which uses it as a highly successful rhetorical device], i don't think it necessarily proves evil does not exist.

rather, i just think it wise to refrain from discussing evil as a force that pervades our society in some mysterious and/or intangible way.

the only manifestation of evil i can see, experience, or touch upon [based on my humble 31 years of observation on this earth as a highly empathetic human with a catholic upbringing], is in people who lack that basic principle of empathy for others.

and, viewing perceived evil through that lens, as a diagnosed mental illness [ie - socipathy, which used to be commonly referred to as psychopathy], allows us to see it as something tangible, that can potentially be treated.

after all, most children exhibit highly sociopathic tendencies in their formative years until they are shown by their parents, and other societal influences, that is it objectively wrong to treat others with any less respect than you would treat yourself.

but either way, i just hope that makes [at least] some sense, doesn't offend you, and stimulates [at least] some further thought and/or discussion.

[zamb]

I will come back ot you later as i am leaving the office now

I went on a car cruise with some friends this weekend to bear mountain. one guy in the group had a tuned E60 M5 with a Dinan stroker motor......when he revved that beast.......boy it was EVIL

[curiouscharles]

I will come back ot you later as i am leaving the office now

I went on a car cruise with some friends this weekend to bear mountain. one guy in the group had a tuned E60 M5 with a Dinan stroker motor......when he revved that beast.......boy it was EVIL

already spent more than my free time allows on writing that today, but i'm always lurking social media if you want to reach me there.