random fashion thoughts

[Pumpfish]

I don't understand why anyone in this parish would get their kex in a bunch over yeezy.

The product, from what I see, looks like Haider's plushy side. Or rick warmed up with a bit of colour. Some nice weights and volumes. Tasteful and not too out there.

The reaction to the enthusiasts is juvenile snobbery.

Disdain of the designer seems rooted in some daft notion of pay your dues. A romantic notion, but the world doesn't work like that.

[lowrey]

The product, from what I see, looks like Haider's plushy side. Or rick warmed up with a bit of colour. Some nice weights and volumes. Tasteful and not too out there.

Yea, you could only show sweatpants and t-shirts from Rick or Haider and it could look very basic and boring, but those represent a fraction of a collection for both designers, whereas in this case it's pretty much all there is to it. That is really all they could come up with because there is no soul or vision or talent behind the clothing - the opposite of Rick or Haider. Honestly dropping these names in this conversation is a terrible idea.

[Pumpfish]

I disagree, Lowrey. The plushy side of haider is the bulk of what makes it to retail and a large chunk of his aesthetic. Rick is comparable because he too creates harmonizing separates which are minimal to the point of basic.

[Lex1017]

I don't understand why anyone in this parish would get their kex in a bunch over yeezy.

The product, from what I see, looks like Haider's plushy side. Or rick warmed up with a bit of colour. Some nice weights and volumes. Tasteful and not too out there.

The reaction to the enthusiasts is juvenile snobbery.

Disdain of the designer seems rooted in some daft notion of pay your dues. A romantic notion, but the world doesn't work like that.

Fair enough, but that doesn't mean I can't think/know that people who haven't are less credible. I don't have to settle for mediocrity because most of the people in the world are shit.

[lowrey]

I disagree, Lowrey. The plushy side of haider is the bulk of what makes it to retail and a large chunk of his aesthetic. Rick is comparable because he too creates harmonizing separates which are minimal to the point of basic.

That doesn't really contradict anything I said above. Whether or not sweatpants are the most popular item, or if it'd be the only thing that makes it to shops (it's not), doesn't change the fact that they are a tiny part of what those two designers create.

[Faust]

I don't understand why anyone in this parish would get their kex in a bunch over yeezy.

The product, from what I see, looks like Haider's plushy side. Or rick warmed up with a bit of colour. Some nice weights and volumes. Tasteful and not too out there.

The reaction to the enthusiasts is juvenile snobbery.

Disdain of the designer seems rooted in some daft notion of pay your dues. A romantic notion, but the world doesn't work like that.

He's not a fucking designer. Stop saying that

[Nickefuge]

[...]because most of the people in the world are shit.

Holy ego, batman!

[Faust]

I'm with Lex. He's not being egotistic. I think it's as accurate of an assessment of humanity as not.

[gregor]

that's probably the greatest truism i've heard in a while, honestly. but, if everyone think that, then who's really better than anyone else?

[galia]

We're all shit as well, only very few people are not, which means we should strive to de-shit ourselves as much as possible (super hard tho )

[Faust]

that's probably the greatest truism i've heard in a while, honestly. but, if everyone think that, then who's really better than anyone else?

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." - Oscar Wilde

[forget it]

I'm not kind of sure what response I'll get about this, but I have a semi-interesting thought that I was talking about with a friend of mine.

Now, a lot of this idea is based off assumptions, so I'll begin by saying I have little to no experience or knowledge of the trends or facets of a low-income urban neighborhood, I am from an upper-middle class white family, whose local mall has an Hermès, Gucci, Prada, Dior, Louis Vuitton, and Saint Laurent (for reference later).

So, I think that Kanye West's foray into fashion will ultimately be a good thing. I think that in general, "high fashion" historically hasn't been so diverse, and only within the last few decades have we seen some change in that. To my knowledge (gained from a Google search), it looks like there has only been two black creative directors of french fashion houses, Givenchy and Balmain. Recently, black designers have ventured into fashion such as Shayne Oliver of Hood By Air and Virgil Abloh of Off-White, to mixed reviews. I think that Kanye's impact as a celebrity allows him to reach a far more diverse audience, and, due to his fame as a hip-hop artist, perhaps communities which otherwise would have not known about high fashion.

As I said, this is a pretty ignorant assumption, however, I'll use very low estimates to offset any ignorance. Also, bear with me through this very silly math, I just want you to know exactly the numbers I used. I saw a statistic that there are 13.4 million people living in impoverished urban areas. If we assume that 20% of those people are "young," we have a population of 2.68 million. While I have to imagine close to 100% of this population knows who Kanye West is, I will make a very low estimate that only 30% of the 2.68 million young people know who he is, perhaps also to account for a language barrier (the statistic didn't include numbers immigrants or non-native English speakers). This gives us 804,000 young people who know who Kanye west is. Now, let's assume that 30% of those people know that Kanye West is fashionable, which leaves us with 241,200 people. Now, let's say that 30% of those people are interested in fashion. That leaves us with 72,360 people. Finally, let's say that 30% of those people go further into Kanye West's celebrity and even understand he wears high fashion. That leaves us with 21,708 people.

Now, all of this math kind of means nothing because my assumptions are based on absolutely no empirical data of Kanye West's celebrity status, however I tried to use low estimates to be as reasonable as possible. Personally, I think his reach extends much further than the numbers I listed, but I don't think that my admittedly arbitrary and ridiculous mathematics there are so unreasonable that they can't be at least considered.

My point is - because of Kanye West, thousands of young people are now interested in fashion who may otherwise have not known about it.

Let me be clear: that is not to say that low-income people "need" Kanye West to know about fashion, nor do I consider Kanye to be any sort of race ambassador that is breaking down barriers. My point is merely that due to his enormous levels of celebrity - not in the least due to his marriage to Kim Kardashian, who presently has nearly 50.8 million followers on Twitter, I might add - it is impossible for his influence to not reach communities which otherwise may not have had a link to high fashion.

I think of it in terms of "links": as I explained before, in my local mall I had multiple outlets for luxury and designer goods. If I had ever desired to have an interest in fashion, it was only a short trip away, and it has been in my face my entire life, not only in malls but in travels as well. For me, the link to high fashion is easy - I originally was interested in Burberry as a designer good because there was an outlet in my mall, I discovered there was such a thing as Burberry Prorsum, I discovered fashion shows, and from there my interest was piqued. I obviously no longer wear Burberry, but to me, that was the introduction I had into the world of high fashion. In my opinion, Kanye west is an "introducer" of people (from ANY background, mind you) to high fashion. If you are from a low-income neighborhood, the chances that you see any of those stores are slim. However, because of Kanye West (and A$AP Rocky, who references Rick Owens and Raf Simons frequently) the link between high fashion and an low-income neighborhood is now present.

As I said, that is not to say there aren't already links - merely that now there is someone who is very publicly introducing and producing high fashion whose level of celebrity brings it to a huge forefront.

High fashion was already increasing in popularity, but before Kanye there was not much of a link between hip-hop and high fashion. Kanye is undoubtedly the most famous rapper who openly speaks about his interest in fashion.

Now, as I said, I think this is a great thing. As I told my friend, while hip-hop fashion is still alive in photographs, no one is archiving old FUBU clothes or Pelle Pelle jackets or Timberlands - whereas I can go to an exhibit in Paris which features Balenciaga dresses since its inception. I think that certainly, runway fashion is a more permanent sphere, and having a community have a voice in this medium is important, the process of which can be much more expedited by having a guy like Kanye introducing people to fashion.

This is not remarking on Kanye's collection, nor his behavior as a human, but I would argue that this will largely be unimportant, as his role as an introducer will be merely that. Any person who wishes to enter a subculture has to start somewhere. I started with Burberry Prorsum, and while I obviously have no desire to wear it anymore, I certainly wouldn't have had a fashion interest without it. Similarly, with Kanye West as an introducer, people will see his work, move past it, and go on to make something better and more impactful.

Now, to be clear, my knowledge of people of color in fashion is very scant. This is also not to say that the voices of other communities are not as important as any other - I'm merely remarking on the communities which I think Kanye West has influence in. I also would welcome anyone introducing any community whatsoever into high fashion and welcome their take on it.

[NOHSAD]

@ Forget It

You're right that Kanye (for better or for worse in my opinion) has contributed a lot to introducing fashion to a lot of kids and teenagers. However, it doesn't change the fact that his take on being a designer is worthy of a face-palm .

Now, regarding low-income individuals (since that's what your post is generalized around) being expose to fashion is harder, It really depends on location and/or the individual.

I grew up in New York. And while my family's, for the most part, your regular middle class one, I live in Queens, farthest place from fashion in NYC as far as i'm concerned and an area where it had it's share of low-income families. Living in NYC though, being exposed to fashion from an early age was fortunately no problem for me, just head over to Manhattan, specifically LES or Soho on the train and boom, I had access.

However, My interest in fashion is a unique one. I grew up wearing streetwear while liking Avant Garde clothing, despite not wearing any of it until years later. JULIUS_7 was my first exposure, saw some images online through Google, a few odd anime forums and a couple from Stylezeitgeist. When I saw his clothes for the first time I thought it was something that came straight from a Japanese Sci-fi anime (Ghost in the Shell to be more exact), it was amazing.

I was 12/13 at the time, in 6th grade. in my mind, Horikawa's clothes was otherworldly and dark.....it was something that captivated me. Something Kayne couldn't do when he was in his College Dropout phase, or Pharrell when he was making BAPE cool in the states.

The short version to this is, despite where you're from or your upbringing, if you like something, you'll find a way to learn more about it. Hell, Yamamoto grew up poor and had a rough childhood. Now, even at his age, still one of the best designers fashion has to offer.



"Recently, black designers have ventured into fashion such as Shayne Oliver of Hood By Air and Virgil Abloh of Off-White"

- Shayne Oliver and Virgil Abloh did the same thing Kanye has done with influencing fashion, except that they at least (which is a give or take based on their history) put in the work. Nevertheless, Designer's like Adrian Savauge and even Maxwell Osborne (1/2 of Public School NYC) are better examples than the former two mentioned.

[zamb]

I had meant to write a post replying to forget it, but there is so much nonsense in his post that i decided against it

Yeezy is NOT high fashion, even though its selling in high end stores
its a shame that high fashion has become now what someone says it is rather than the quality and technical mastery build into the clothes

one could have a discussion as to whether black designers or black people are under represented in fashion and that's has its own issues.

I am a Jamaican, I grew up dirt poor. Now I own a fashion brand in NY selling High fashion......

here are some names for you

Patrick Kelly
Patrick Robinson
Tracy Reece
Oswald Boateng
Ron and Ron
Steven Burrows
Carly Kushnie
Patrick Robinson
Edward Wilkerson
Joey Casley Hayford
Zam Barrett
Gavin Douglas
Erik Gaskins


I could go on, but you can do some research..........

[Arkady]

That whole impoverished urban calculation is like nails on a chalkboard, that was quite a longwinded way to say the inventor of leather jogging pants has a lot of page likes.