Carol Christian Poell

[eleven crows]

A jacket by Carol Christian Poell! This has been the dream of my life ever since I was a child, and it's all happening because I'm completely ignoring every urge towards common sense and good judgement I've ever had. This is no longer just some crazy notion. This is my religion.

[cremaster]

I can't understand the whinging on the price.
The hand made, artistic and innovative should be rewarded, handsomely.
The fine artist at the top of the tree is richly compensated.
CCP is at the top of his field, his prices have risen steadily so who can deny him what he gets?

I just read an interview with Ed Ruscha where out of his first 2 shows at Ferus Gallery he sold only 1 work. Now those works are all in major museums and he is worth millions. I don't see anyone begrudging him his prices or success.

[Peasant]

Exactly. If you don't like the price, don't buy it. You're paying for concept, design & construction of both fabrics & the garmet as a whole. The crushable boots are 5k. I think that's more ridiculous. But someone bought a pair. The ballers buying Carol far surpass SZers. 8K is nothing to some.

[lowrey]

It all comes down to how you regard clothing. 5k for a necessity is obviously a lot, but if you consider it more as "art" or something collectible, then it has an entirely different value.

[Peasant]

For sure. I imagine they're on display somewhere. They're barely wearable -No shoe/cup inside.

[Johnny]

clothes as art...the last bastion of the desperate attempt to justify ridiculously overpriced clothing. poell's, em, clothes are not art, since they are clothes. he sells them to shops that sell clothes. he does not sell them to galleries; no one would buy them if he did since there's no market (on the whole) for "art" that takes the form of functional clothing.
anyway, perhaps more fundamentally, why is labelling something "art" an auto-justifier of price? can't art be over- or at least outlandishly-priced? the fact that someone shells out for it doesn't change that. fools and their money etc.,....

[shawn]

I guess If you don't label it as "ART" it's too hard to sell these clothes at this price range. That's also the job what CCP's PR company is doing.

In short, CCP is telling a "story" nothing specially like other big brands: LV, Hermes and Chanel etc just in a very different niche market.

Clothes = Art? okay, fine. but please understand Art = Business (at least in 21st Century).

Having a 8K price tag coat is not a big deal at all as long as he won't setup flagship store in every city and produce lots of bags and accessories.

[Peasant]

I'm not outright defending the spending. Lord knows I'd never spend it. It's all based on context. Look at the price of diamond engagement rings. His fabrics are much more limited.

I pay for certain Carol pieces and find them worth every penny. I don't view them as art.

It's amusing to hear the argument from a league of people who find a $250 t-shirt normal.

[Agent L]

I'm not outright defending the spending. Lord knows I'd never spend it. It's all based on context. Look at the price of diamond engagement rings. His fabrics are much more limited.

I pay for certain Carol pieces and find them worth every penny. I don't view them as art.

It's amusing to hear the argument from a league of people who find a $250 t-shirt normal.

No need to defend anything from my perspective. It's all relative. If you're willing to spend X amount on this or that, it all boils down to what makes you happy. When I see a hot pink Ferrari or a bedazzled Affliction tee, I don't ask why. I say more power to them. To each their own. And yes, I bring up hot pink Ferraris and Affliction tees because I have a whole cadre of them

[cjbreed]

i think people need to remember there are different levels of balling. there's SZ balling, and then there's mega balling. for some people, 5k is like an after thought. they will earn more than 5k in the time it takes to reach into their wallet and pull out the amex. much of ccp's stuff goes to these people, especially the wackier stuff like the crumpled boots. they are for the mega baller ccp junky that has everything. and ccp can get this kind of $$ because his shit is truly that awesome. his little world is totally unique in fashion/clothing, etc and has a very convincing and powerful appeal.

also keep in mind many of the mega ballers of the world are also often involved in some sort of serious philanthropy, so its not fair to bring the moral attack against them for their shopping habits. unless they are of the russian gangster mega baller variety and then its best to just stay quiet about the whole thing

[Faust]

I guess If you don't label it as "ART" it's too hard to sell these clothes at this price range. That's also the job what CCP's PR company is doing.

In short, CCP is telling a "story" nothing specially like other big brands: LV, Hermes and Chanel etc just in a very different niche market.

Clothes = Art? okay, fine. but please understand Art = Business (at least in 21st Century).

Having a 8K price tag coat is not a big deal at all as long as he won't setup flagship store in every city and produce lots of bags and accessories.

I'm sorry, Poell has a PR company? I was not aware of that. He is actually staunchly anti-PR (which of course to those of you who are cynical beyond salvation, is also PR).

And his clothes are expensive? Sure. Compared to what? What was the last time you visited a women's section of a high-end department store or opened a women's editorial of Vogue or T-Magazine? Have you seen those prices?

[holger]

check into a Valentino, Hermes, Chanel etc Store, and you will see a really high price ...

[lowrey]

There is something like romanticsing the design and fabrication process too much though. I don't say one has to live humble to excess, but be aware that a coat like this can feed quite a lot people for quite a long time (this awareness being far from whinging). The difference is, as Lowrey says, how you regard it. As a piece clothing and something to be used, it is crossing the line in my opinion, as art, being in an exhibition, private or public, it's not, especially not if it's unique.

How many people can a 100k painting feed? Afterall, isn't everything we discuss here premium compared to "standard" goods, for example $50 shoes which serve the same purpose.

As for how one regards clothing, I don't see an issue with viewing it both as something collectible (not art, zomg) as well as just clothing. At least thats how I view some of my clothing, I certainly value some piece as more than just a random garment, but I still wear them like I would anything else. Some items I might not even wear that often but I enjoy owning them. This is particularly the case with some of Poell's work.

clothes as art...the last bastion of the desperate attempt to justify ridiculously overpriced clothing.

I'm only using the word art for the lack of a better term, possibly due to my limited english vocabulary. Like I said, everything we discuss here is beyond daily necessities and has an aesthetical and sentimental value, no one needs $1500 shoes or even $200 shoes. What we get for that price is obviously something else than the simple purpose of that garment. How much more you are ready to pay for this premium is up to everyones own discretion.

anyway, perhaps more fundamentally, why is labelling something "art" an auto-justifier of price? can't art be over- or at least outlandishly-priced? the fact that someone shells out for it doesn't change that. fools and their money etc.,....

its not the word that justifies it, but the value it holds to whoever is buying it.Theres no better logic to paying $50,000 for a sculpture or $5000 for a piece of furniture or any design object. This is why I use the art comparison.

[cowsareforeating]

I can't understand the whinging on the price.
The hand made, artistic and innovative should be rewarded, handsomely.
The fine artist at the top of the tree is richly compensated.
CCP is at the top of his field, his prices have risen steadily so who can deny him what he gets?

I just read an interview with Ed Ruscha where out of his first 2 shows at Ferus Gallery he sold only 1 work. Now those works are all in major museums and he is worth millions. I don't see anyone begrudging him his prices or success.

i dont believe the whining is about the price, its more about indoctrination ; too many OMG CCP and not enough deliberate consideration...

[Umami]

Exactly. If you don't like the price, don't buy it. You're paying for concept, design & construction of both fabrics & the garmet as a whole. The crushable boots are 5k. I think that's more ridiculous. But someone bought a pair. The ballers buying Carol far surpass SZers. 8K is nothing to some.

even Balmain can reach 5000 Dollars why not CCP