Yohji Yamamoto SS09 Paris

[sbw4224]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



[quote user="Johnny"]How is he doing that, rather than allowing people to pretend they're 20 years older than they really are?[/quote]

I think it just comes down to the fact that majority of his customers are already older (45+)and looking for clothes that reflect their age. In less than eloquent phrasing, I was attempting to contrast Yohji's ideals with the designers who attempt touse the youthfulness of their clothes, whether that be in the cut (Thom Browne), the very slim sizing (old Dior Homme, etc.), or even down to the boyish runway models.

I'm going to apologize ahead of time because I'm typing this quickly at work and I'm not entirely sure if this makes sense.

I am interesting, though, in hearing your thoughts if you disagree. I'm a relatively new follower of Yohji so my observations are often a bit off.

[philip nod]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

[quote user="matthewhk"]

[quote user="Johnny"]How is he doing that, rather than allowing people to pretend they're 20 years older than they really are?[/quote]

LOL

Yohji is a state of mind...i can't think of another clothing line that exists out there that has such an effect on the wearer.

On another note, I also think that nowadays people are way too concerned with things having to look "right." It has to "fit" right. It has to be "appropriate." Everything has to look symmetrical, proper, the slightest hint of flaw or imperfection is scrutinized and magnified a thousand times. And I think this goes beyond just clothing and aesthetics, even into the realm of human behavior where consistency of thought and action is a must, to the point it is becoming robotic rather than human. And the fact so many people seem blind to this key fundamental of human nature is really quite appaling. In this context, there's nothing more liberating than wearing something that is painstakingly made with care yet still fits totally "off," whether for body or age or what have you.

[/quote]

hmmm. carol and rick come to my state of mind

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



yeah i'll give you Carol....i was actually thinking about this in the shower just now and it hit me that i forgot him.

Rick, yeaaaaaah perhaps in the design. But I dunno man it seems everybody and their mother is trying to get on the Rick train these days, i seen some unlikely people trying on the stuff here at Joyce. I know that got nothing to do with the work itself but somehow dilutes its image in my mind.

[Faust]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

[quote user="matthewhk"]

yeah i'll give you Carol....i was actually thinking about this in the shower just now and it hit me that i forgot him.

Rick, yeaaaaaah perhaps in the design. But I dunno man it seems everybody and their mother is trying to get on the Rick trainers these days, i seen some unlikely people trying on the stuff here at Joyce. I know that got nothing to do with the work itself but somehow dilutes its image in my mind.

[/quote]

fixed your typo

[philip nod]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

but isn't YY w his endless permutations actually more guilty of this than Rick?

[what_counts]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



julius presents themselves as a lifestyle and state of mind lulz

edit: on another note i actually really like this collection even though its a suit collection it really signifies yohji, granted everything is a bit toned down and more wearable but thats not always a bad thing

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



[quote user="philip nod"]but isn't YY w his endless permutations actually more guilty of this than Rick?
[/quote]

well i think Yohji, in terms of his menswear, has always done a pretty good job of presenting his worldview when it came to his ideal image of masculinity pretty well and in a fairly wide range of ways, even though the "core" (those permutations you speak of) was always there. There's not much movement from season to season except in small details, you're right. i look at this and think that i can/have put together similar looks with stuff i've acquired over various seasons.

perhaps i am too biased in my adoration of yohji to discuss this more objectively.

[Avantster]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



OK. I've stayed out of this thread for a while because I wasn't too sure what to make of it, but here are some thoughts.

I was initially a little disappointed by this collection. It struck me as an ordinary (for Yohji) suit collection with his signature intricate detailing. But after seeing the last picture, where Yohji walks out with the older models, this made me consider that this collection could be mainly about the man himself. As an man who has been successful in the fashion world for thirty years, what more does he have to prove? He has reached the pinnacle of his career and may be (god forbid) close to retirement. Perhaps this could be his way of leaving behind one personal collection that is about clothes that he would wear, everyday.

The more I look at this, the more I like it.

God is in the details:

Love the fabric and faint red shoulder stitching.

Don't forget the back!

This jacket was interesting and while the front seems a little to literal, note the back. I suspect it looks much better in motion.

Also, those laceups look really great.

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

i don't think this collection is so much about him as it is about him describing a world in which real men (as envisioned by Yohji in his mind) age from youth to old, faust asked where is the world he usually creates...i think it may not be as obvious as some of his other recent collections, but it's definitely there. A story of aging ... trying to make it through the day in front of a backdrop of turbulent and violent times.

[Chinorlz]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



[quote user="matthewhk"]i don't think this collection is so much about him as it is about him describing a world in which real men (as envisioned by Yohji in his mind) age from youth to old, faust asked where is the world he usually creates...i think it may not be as obvious as some of his other recent collections, but it's definitely there. A story of aging ... trying to make it through the day in front of a backdrop of turbulent and violent times.
[/quote]

I guess I've just never really understood Yohji. So.... it's well made but always just baggy? I see no tailoring skills there then when everything is just oversized. Not to say it's BAD per se, but I just don't see why people flock to it or why he has built an empire.

Overall I can only fathom that he's done so because 45+ year old men that want to be "fashionable" but have let their bodies go have something to wear now that they can spend large sums of money on and still fit into.

How come no one has mentioned Yohji's odd use of a plus size black model on the runway in the middle of everything? That with the old men almost marginalizes the clothes for me. He had to rely on model gimmicks that detract from the clothes (newspaper, milk?) and unfortunately make them so very ordinary.... and why would people (I know they do... but the logic defies me) pay a serious premium for ordinary?

Some of the detail shots show some really lovely work but it seems like that's the minority of what went down the runway. The blazer/coat hybrid is just plain lazy and too trendy. You could only wear it once a year.

[soultek]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



^ I was kind of the same way. Until I tried on a bunch of pieces and bought a couple, then I got it. His tailoring skills are pretty fantastic.

All this talk of 45+ year old men being core customers makes me feel like a geezer for liking him!

I agree that the fit and appeal is more 'democratic' than most lines. But isn't this a good thing? I think he makes clothes that are relatively timeless, appeal to a wide base of customers, and fits a range of bodies. You also cannot fault the man himself if people want his clothes for dodgy reasons (looking 'fashionable'). Honestly I feel that the people after 'fashionable' clothes might flock to Prada instead (but then again I'm from LA..)

Furthermore, I think it makes sense that a man of his age should be designing clothes from his perspective, not trying to get into the head of youth culture.

[matthewhk]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

Albert i guess Yohji just isn't your cup of tea....i willsay though in today's fashion zeitgeist YY does seem to be a bit of an acquired taste compared to a lot of other brands out there that are more 'in tune' with trends and what not. His clothes are loose fitting, but he makes a lot of clothes that are slimmer too they probably don't pop up on the runway presentations as much. There's some stuff in here that's well tailored even by conventional standards. As for the baggier stuff, you can say it's shapeless but there's a certain drape and movement to his clothes that you can't really equate with the typical 'shapeless' American mall style clothing. I guess it really has to be seen, touched, even tried on in person to fully appreciate. In photos a lot of times it definitely doesn't come across as so flattering or special.

[soultek]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



Oh, and not everything is baggy. Did you try on the black pants from SS08 at Atelier? I thought they were relatively slim fitting.

[Chinorlz]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris



Thanks for the responses Soultek and of course Matt :)

I definitely wanted to hear Matt's take on the line in general. I know I occasionally rehash the "why Yohji" thing every so often but I find it interesting to hear why people gravitate towards certain designers and lines.

The first Yohji buy at Atelier was VERY surprising to me. Definitely a number of slimmer pieces but with such an expansive line, I wonder if the slimmer/more fitted pieces are even envisioned by Mr. Yamamoto himself. I like that he wears his own stuff and that he has stuck with his silhouette no matter what. Even though he uses predominantly "classic" slim models, the clothes are still drapey and large.

Next time I'm somewhere where they have a full rack of Yohji. I'm going to put on a full outfit and see what it's like when worn :)

[soultek]

Re: Yohji Yamamoto ss09 Paris

[quote user="Chinorlz"]

Next time I'm somewhere where they have a full rack of Yohji. I'm going to put on a full outfit and see what it's like when worn :)

[/quote]

Let us know what you think when you do, I'd love to hear your opinion!