Buying & Selling Online using Paypal

[diorowen]

sending money as a gift means you are just giving the money, and its not for purchasing something.
so in case nothing come from the seller, the buyer cant claim it.
sending as gift will also charge less pp fees compare to send as payment..
but again, I rather send it as payment, spend couple more bucks but you will have a rest of heart :p
anyone can add it?

[sinbad]

sending money as a gift means you are just giving the money, and its not for purchasing something.
so in case nothing come from the seller, the buyer cant claim it.
sending as gift will also charge less pp fees compare to send as payment..
but again, I rather send it as payment, spend couple more bucks but you will have a rest of heart :p
anyone can add it?

Thank you!
How to I send as gift?
send at personal payment,right?

[mononon]

yes, personal payment is gift, although i think they are some small fees now (not sure if this was said before...)

[ardeetee]

n/m a gift payment does have to be from a pp balance or bank transfer, cc incurs a fee

[diorowen]

dont think so..pp gift with credit card will charge more..pp from bank account charge like 1%..
never try pp with pp balance though..
and pp for payment charge 4% >_<

[treasurehoard]

=
so in case nothing come from the seller, the buyer cant claim it.

If they send a gift payment with a CC, as a seller, you could still end up getting a chargeback for unauthorized use if the CC is stolen. Depending on the circumstances if the payment was sent normally (not a gift) you might be covered by seller protection, with a gift payment you won't have any seller protection and will lose your money and item.

[diorowen]

so basically its there is no pros for both seller and buyer if something happen :(...only use pp as gift with your trusted seller though..

[taylen]

the only thing you should do for buyer protection or seller protection. the conversation between the buyer and the seller for selling or buying the item (all the seller and buyer information, tracking numbers, the adresses, etc..) when doing business that has to save it, then the buyer/seller can approve it to the paypal or FBI or etc when the buyer/the seller try to scam you. It might take for awhile but better than you get scammed.

[treasurehoard]

^ That info might be useful for reporting to http://www.ic3.gov/default.aspx (FBI, NW3C, BJA) but paypal will just tell you that because you didn't follow the rules you don't have any protection through them.

Even if you have e-mails saying the buyer said it was delivered and they loved it etc paypal would just ignore them and decide in the cardholders favor. It is a completely 1 sided process where the seller is SOL the majority of the time. Paypal fees suck but if you are selling an item that is hundreds or thousands of dollars better to pay and make sure you are protected in case the buyer is not honest.

IC3 might be able to recover your money at some point but it can take months or even years for the chance this might happen. Some of these scammers really do their home work and have unwitting people forwarding mail to them in other countries and all sorts of crazy schemes. It is always worth reporting though because the more complaints against someone the more likely they will start taking some action.

There was a really in depth program on NBC a while back Dateline: To Catch An ID Thief. It shows just how far some of these scammers go and how difficult it is to track them down.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17805134/ns/dateline_nbc-to_catch_an_id_thief

This scammer (pretending to be some beautiful model) basically had a guy shipping them stuff from the US to Africa that was being purchased with stolen CCs. They conned the guy into paying for all of the shipping out of his own pocket. Then on top of this they pulled a scam with in a scam by saying they were injured in a car accident and needed the guy to wire money to pay for surgery! Sounds like fiction but this stuff happens all the time w/ online transactions.

[jgan85]

Not so much about paypal, but more about eBay.

Bought a suit, Canadian seller says shipping will be $35 for USPS Priority equivalent. I pay the invoiced total, and wait. Two and a half weeks pass, nothing. I contact the seller, and after some delay he responds that the package hasn't arrived because he decided to ship it by surface mail instead, which will take 8 weeks. Offer, rather curtly, a $5 refund. I tell him to keep the $5, and that it's common courtesy to inform me after shipping + that he's shipped via a different, much slower service.

Anybody encountered this before? If the item doesn't arrive before the end of the eBay feedback period, shall I just give him a straight negative?

J

EDIT: seller has about 150 feedback I believe, so not a new user.

mmm i'm not looking for a refund of the difference in shipping, just want to wear the item soon, but i guess that's not possible as it stands.

no ultimatum, of course, but i will take your advice and open an eBay dispute for sure.

thank you!

J

EDIT: I just sent the seller a message asking for some proof of shipping or the like. Very interestingly, I notice that he input a tracking number into the eBay system. However, that number is wrong, because inputting that number into the Canada Post website shows a South Korean destination address. Clearly, I'm not in South Korea.

^ sshum88: much obliged, yes I just took the seller's rate at face value, perhaps he doesn't ship out of NA much

yes in SG, its about 3 weeks now, so 5 more weeks going by the seller's ETA, I wrote him a message asking about the discrepancy in the tracking number provided, but no response, so I guess I will wait til Monday for a response, write him another message asking for the number once more, and if he doesn't respond, file a claim straight.

Will post up the seller's details if it eventually turns out that he's not legit.

J

EDIT: finally got it, in a musty-smelling package.

J
________
DOWNLOAD REPLAY SC2

[ironman]

right now i'm dealing with a buyer from hell in a PayPal Significantly Not As Described claim. fucking worst situation ever. the buyer knows the boots are used, and acknowledges it in both an email (same as on his paypal acct) and in eBay messages, plus the item is listed as Pre-Owned.

he also somehow claims the boots were supposed to be Black but are Blue, despite the pictures showing them as blue and me writing in the eBay listing it is Blue

despite all this, PayPal sides in his favor. i call them and ask them what the fuck they decided without asking me for proof that i said i would gladly provide (i wasn't allowed to upload anything to the claim) and i explained everything to them.

you know what they said? oh, well emails can be falsified. and eBay messages are not valid proof. i said why the fuck not? it's an eBay item. they said oh he claimed it with paypal not ebay. ebay owns paypal wtf holy fucking shit

i told them as well in their PayPal User Agreement section 13.6 it says a buyer cannot claim SNAD if "the item has minor scratches and was listed as used condition" so why the fuck do they even have to think about it? and they're like oh well it's too late we already made the decision. the buyer didn't even have to send them any proof, and they didn't even fucking look at my eBay listing

so now he's shipping it back for a refund but i don't want to give him one. he scratched out the size in an attempt to say it is more damaged, and i can't appeal the decision cuz he already uploaded a tracking number. there's no way for me to protect myself and prove that he will even send back the correct item

so my "small" question is:

if i ignore UPS and don't sign for the item (in which they hold it for a few days and then return the item back to him) and claim i never received any notice or attempted delivery to my door, do you think PayPal will still refund the buyer?

it says in the user agreement that "If a seller refuses to accept the item, PayPal may award the Claim in favour of the buyer, provided the buyer has provided satisfactory evidence to PayPal that the item was sent to the seller." however i don't know how much they really stick by their user agreement (see above re: 13.6)

but i don't want to risk accepting it and opening it and finding he returned somethign else. it says online that the package is 6.8 lbs (3 kg). how can i prove to PayPal that what i get back is what i sent? i asked them what is sufficient proof/documentation and they literally told me that they'll tell me when it happens

i especially don't want to risk this happening and finding PayPal fucks me again and i'm out the boots and the money. since he's shipping it with UPS, isn't that like guaranteed brokerage and customs rape fees too?

what would you do? :(

[timberlakeld]

right now i'm dealing with a buyer from hell in a PayPal Significantly Not As Described claim. fucking worst situation ever. the buyer knows the boots are used, and acknowledges it in both an email (same as on his paypal acct) and in eBay messages, plus the item is listed as Pre-Owned.

he also somehow claims the boots were supposed to be Black but are Blue, despite the pictures showing them as blue and me writing in the eBay listing it is Blue

despite all this, PayPal sides in his favor. i call them and ask them what the fuck they decided without asking me for proof that i said i would gladly provide (i wasn't allowed to upload anything to the claim) and i explained everything to them.

you know what they said? oh, well emails can be falsified. and eBay messages are not valid proof. i said why the fuck not? it's an eBay item. they said oh he claimed it with paypal not ebay. ebay owns paypal wtf holy fucking shit

i told them as well in their PayPal User Agreement section 13.6 it says a buyer cannot claim SNAD if "the item has minor scratches and was listed as used condition" so why the fuck do they even have to think about it? and they're like oh well it's too late we already made the decision. the buyer didn't even have to send them any proof, and they didn't even fucking look at my eBay listing

so now he's shipping it back for a refund but i don't want to give him one. he scratched out the size in an attempt to say it is more damaged, and i can't appeal the decision cuz he already uploaded a tracking number. there's no way for me to protect myself and prove that he will even send back the correct item

so my "small" question is:

if i ignore UPS and don't sign for the item (in which they hold it for a few days and then return the item back to him) and claim i never received any notice or attempted delivery to my door, do you think PayPal will still refund the buyer?

it says in the user agreement that "If a seller refuses to accept the item, PayPal may award the Claim in favour of the buyer, provided the buyer has provided satisfactory evidence to PayPal that the item was sent to the seller." however i don't know how much they really stick by their user agreement (see above re: 13.6)

but i don't want to risk accepting it and opening it and finding he returned somethign else. it says online that the package is 6.8 lbs (3 kg). how can i prove to PayPal that what i get back is what i sent? i asked them what is sufficient proof/documentation and they literally told me that they'll tell me when it happens

i especially don't want to risk this happening and finding PayPal fucks me again and i'm out the boots and the money. since he's shipping it with UPS, isn't that like guaranteed brokerage and customs rape fees too?

what would you do? :(

Oh,man ... you are so unlucky.
Yes, Paypal is fucked.. they never thought of protecting seller's benfits.. comeon, not only a seller can be a scammer..

List out the buyer's user name in order to warn other sellers to beware of him...

[endersgame]

can you counter-file a complaint against the buyer with ebay? whatever reason paypal decided to not hear your case, maybe ebay can do something..

[treasurehoard]

^^^

If you refuse the package the buyer can just contact them and you will lose the case - your money and your item. They won't require that he send it back a 2nd time.

If they send back something other than what you sent, you can file an appeal. However appeals are meaningless. If paypal decides the appeal in your favor they will send you an e-mail saying you need to contact the buyer to collect the money. They will not force the buyer to repay so unless you have an honest buyer, which is not the case here, or you're going to hound them like a collection agent until they pay you are screwed. You can also report them to various fraud agencies.

If the package is coming internationally UPS may hit you with brokerage fees. Depends on where the package is coming from and where you are as to how much they will be. Best to contact UPS about that and they can give you an estimate.

Although the transaction was on eBay they will not offer any help. If the dispute had been filed on eBay they would have come to the same conclusion and sided with the buyer. eBay/PayPal sides with the buyer the majority of the time now. A few years ago sellers used to have a chance of winning a dispute. Now though if the buyer just says they do not like the item that is all it takes. Doesn't matter if you describe it perfectly.


eBay is trying to make the buyers satisfied well screwing over the sellers. They are "forcing" sellers to accept returns but pretending like sellers have a choice in the matter.


Your best bet is to accept the package and hope the buyer sent the item back. Better to have the item then no money and no item.

[treasurehoard]

they are not able to reactivate my account.
More than 1k€ on my account, that they're gonna keep 180 days and i'm not allowed to create a new paypal account.

That is typical paypal right there. Many people have had similar experiences.

http://www.paypalsucks.com/

I sold a PlayStation 3 back when they 1st came out. They held all of the money in my account for over 2 weeks well they waited for the buyer to receive the item. The total amount I sold that system for accounted for a very small % of the money I was taking into the account on a monthly basis. They still held all of the money. They even held incoming payments and wouldn't let me print shipping labels on the site until they buyer had the item and left feedback on eBay.

Reactivating your account will be a nightmare if they even let you do it. Getting your money back prior to 180 days will require some good luck or a lawsuit. If you sue them they will definitely never reactivate your account.